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Old 01-31-2011, 11:13 AM   #25
Underwater Ophelia
 
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Earth.
Posts: 8,001
Quote:
Originally Posted by Despanan View Post
This "abuse" that you talk about is actually a very negligible part of society.

Do you know why welfare exists Ophie? It exists, not to coddle the lazy and the weak, it exists to prevent crime and revolt.

People naturally will work as hard as they can to perpetuate their own existence, and as dumb as one might be when the chips are down, any sane person will stuggle as hard as they can to prevent death and keep themselves in a livable situation.

No matter how fair we make things, some people are always going to slip through the cracks, some people will always find themselves in a somewhat hopeless situation. Maybe you made a few mistakes, got addicted to drugs, and lost your job. Maybe you did everything right, but got hit by a car, and your job's health insurance dropped you. Maybe you got a graduate degree from a top univerisity, but no one wanted to hire somewone with your particular skills. What if you got knocked up at a young age and now have a family to feed; without outside support, without an education and a high-paying job, what then?

You're swimming in debt, losing your apartment, you might even be out on the street, your kids are going hungry and arte now missing school. What are you going to do? Sell all your stuff and move somewhere in a last gambit? Try to find a McJob and live on the street? What if that doesn't work? What if no one will hire your now, smelly, desperate ass? What then? Do you give your kids to the state and then curl up and die?

No. It will take MONTHS to die naturally, and your body will be SCREAMING to fulfill those needs. Your deep rooted survival instincts will kick in and guess what you'll do? You'll go to war.

Maybe you rob someone, maybe you scam someone, maybe you kill someone, maybe you form a mob with other peasants and break into a rich families home. Maybe you get away with it, maybe you get caught, maybe you get killed. When society fails you, when your basic needs are not met you will lash out against society.

The lack of a social safety net creates criminals, it creates terrorists, it creates violent revolutionaries.

Just like the women who secretly delighted in abortions and used them as a means of birth control existed primarily in Versus's mind, these people you argue against, these parasites don't exist in a way that significantly impacts society, yet you want legislation to prevent them.

The anti-social will always exist: criminal, the insane, the diseased, the mentally handicapped, but they are not some boogeyman that can be defeated by championing hard work and personal responsibility. Most everyone believes in hard work and personal responsibility, and at the end of the day your ideals are naive and attempting to force society to live by them perpetuates a culture of abuse by the powerful and the wealthy and further de-stabalizes those of us who weren't born into wealth. Libertarianism and Objectivism creates a culture of economic tyrants and violent underclasses. That's just reality.

It is just good business to provide the basic necessities of life for everyone, because the only other options are euthinization of those in extreme poverty, or the unintentional destabalization of society through the creation of a class of desperate antisocials.
What you're saying would apply to this conversation if I ever said that social programs should be done away with in entirety. You're arguing with someone that isn't here.
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