[Gypsy2222]

Originally Posted by Giga

Well, I'm not a real goth but I believe most people who are creative and like dark things by nature have a possibility of evolving into goth culture.

I grew up in a "normal" (normal in: non-goth, non-molesting, non-junkie, non-ultrarich, just classical middle class family) and from my earliest ages I loved horror movies, I liked undead, I liked all those terrible things that made the rest of my family shudder. I always liked to draw and at the age of 7 I began drawing comics which quickly evolved. I was always creative, making campaigns for WarCraft II and StarCraft and always trying to bring in something new. I loved music very much too. Eventualy I went to writting and today I'm quite close to publishing my first book.

During my whole life I loved bloody dark things, my comics are full of slaughters and evil guys, my pictures are no different, my role playing campaigns (I was a GM for a few years) and my books are all aiming to shock and inspire fear and are all populated by different (usualy psychologicaly instable) characters.

So yes, you could say I like dark things.

So with time, as I found out I like "evil" music (black metal, MM etc.) more then the usual stuff that's popular in Serbia, I started hanging out at goth (as far as any Serbian goth can be considered goth) and realized that people won't care much about the way I act. There are the usual "truer then thou" morons but fuck them, I don't hang around with that kind of people, they're as shallow as typical goth-haters.

Now I'm pretty much wearing clothes and living the life I like. I don't think I was born as a goth, no way, I found a taste for it and eventualy evolved into it (although, I repeat, I'm not a true goth, I'm just Mijat Vujacic, nothing more nothing less).

EDIT:
Another thing that could in a way support my theory that people evolve into goths is plain proof. There are many people who, by their characteristics could be considered goths yet they simply aren't goths. Par example:

Stephen King - a great writer, horror specialists, has a gargolye on his house gate, is very creative, adores dark things and is into leather wear, motors, hard rock and metal music etc. All the things "needed" for a regular goth. Yet he simply isn't a goth, he's just a man who has all those properties yet doesn't dress and act like a goth. He could but he didn't evolve into a goth.

Marilyn Manson - of all people he is creative in so many ways, he's very individualistic, you could say that the way he dresses is very unique and, I daresay, gothish. But hey, he doesn't consider himself a goth and would never want to be a goth, he's just himself.

They're the first people that come to mind, both fit the "Goth With A Sledgehammer" goth properties (I read it very carefuly yesterday) yet neither are goth. They just havent "evolved".

That is a very well thought out perspective... However, in regards to Marilyn Manson. As much as I am irritated by some of the things the man says, he does have my respect as an artist and a genuinely intelligent person (albeit a bit off... but such is the case with many intellectuals). I would come to the conclusion that the man is Goth and simply does not choose to label himself as such due to media steriotyping...

I would also say similar things of Stephen King, pointing out my position that "The clothes do not make the Goth..." (after all... look at me, Mr. "I'm in the army" goth.... lol...)

Both of these people are indeed "Just themselves..." but isn't that also a part of being goth? The need to be ones self outside of the social stigma?

Originally Posted by Mr.Maelstrom

My point: either nobody is born a goth or everybody is a latent goth, but there is something that triggers it. The capacity to appreciatte the beauty gypsy mentioned exists in all, but lays dormant and may stay there all your life and may never stirr. Obviously, because you're reading this, something DID stirr; or your just reading this to try to learn how to pick up goth chicks (I give private courses on it and accept all major credit cards)

To a degree I would agree Mael (if I may be so personal to call you such, no insult intended, I simply consider you a friend), however, I would pose it as "Everyone has the ability to appreciate beauty, it is what forms of beauty we appreciate and or create that makes one goth or not." I find that the beauty we create and surround ourselves with is an expression of whom we are and whom we would choose to be... I think that some lack the ability to appreciate more of the darker side of art, be it through self denial of their inner natures, or some other course due to birth and the nature of genetics...


A little about myself... (oh, how libra's enjoy talking about themselves.... lol...) I myself didn't until recently decide to call myself "goth" per se. Due to media and social steriotyping, my perception of exactly what goth was was distorted and was nothing close to even resembling the truth... so I decided to give myself another label... a morbidly poetic free thinker... Recently, in my wanderings and studies, I came across several old school goth writings and contacted several goths themselves in order to get my perspective straight because their writings engendered in me the response of a similar soul... What they relegated to me was a general discription of who they were and why they wrote what they wrote..... I realized then that I had borne the nature of "goth" within me through out the course of my entire life... so in the end, I am myself, I am Goth..... (It still bears a strangeness about my tongue when I say it though... Again thanks to my social conditioning...). I had always danced with goths as they were the only ones who moved as I did... I had always spoken with goths over coffee about philosophy... and all of that time (due to social stigma and my own denseness) I had no idea that I was indeed goth... I laugh at myself now... but it is kind of sad that I allowed such social standards to prejudice my thinking in such a way... I'll not let it happen again, I shall instead take all matters into consideration that I can and shall be not afraid to ask others their opinion... discounting none (hence this thread...)

So I remain in my position that a goth is born goth and simply does not realize it until later... though a catalystic event and proper information may be a cause for such a realization... on that note I'll end...

P.S I do appologize for the purple Giga, it's just that I find it aesthetically pleasing and a lighter shade of purple is frighteningly close to pink... lol... my appologies to all those out there who like pink, it is meant as no insult, it is simply a matter of personal taste...

Always Respectfully,
~The Gypsy~