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Old 06-27-2008, 08:00 AM   #1
Katharos_Rayne
 
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Hi, hello and help required!

Hi to all,

Im Kat, just came across the forum and wanted to sign up mainly to get to know more like-minded individuals and also to ask for some help if at all possible?

See I'm re-visiting my thesis on the Goth movement and was wondering if anyone on the board would be willing to answer a few questions either via a thread (so others can use) or just by PMs, whatever people feel most at ease with.

my main question for everyone/anyone is:-

As a goth/alternative individual, what do you make of the stereotypes that are bandered about through the media? Also, have you been inflicted with stereotypes and how does this make you feel/think.


Sorry to be a bore!

Katharos
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Old 06-27-2008, 08:15 AM   #2
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No problem, you're not being boring.

I think it's an interesting relationship between trying to be in cohesive styles while still being unique that draws up stereotypes. In my own opinion The Gothic movement is going to rise with the rise in technology. People need human interaction, but that interaction is dwindling less and less with the rise of computers. Only some small percentage of what we say is actual words, leaving the blanks filled in with our own thoughts on how they are reacting. You may or may not notice that many Gothic films, stories and art are almost void of computers. Everything is very natural, pastal and pale, not bright and vivid like many computer oriented advertisements and websites. Intellectual and creative people feel robbed by the intrusion of the computers and this is a vauge revolt of our subconcious.

We just don't want our thinking done for us. We need to be creative on our own accord and to make something unique.
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Old 06-27-2008, 08:17 AM   #3
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thanks! bahm, i have to have this done by tuesday or i dont graduate! lol no pressure there then? -.-'
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Old 06-27-2008, 08:54 AM   #4
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Eh, I remember those days... they wern't that dramatic, but I remember scrambling over assignments.
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Old 06-27-2008, 12:40 PM   #5
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Honestly, while you still have some time, I'd change the topic of the paper.
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Old 06-27-2008, 02:07 PM   #6
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I have to say that the thing I dislike the most about how goth is portrayed in the media is the fact that it leads to people thinking that goth is some sort of movement. Goth is music and fashion, that is it. There is no belief system, no morals, and no attitude that should be associated with the subculture. That and it is a subculture, not a counterculture, people need to stop trying to make it more than it is.
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Old 06-27-2008, 05:39 PM   #7
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I'm in agreement with Ophelia and Solumina here.
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Old 06-28-2008, 04:59 AM   #8
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thanks for the input so far *sigh* i wish i could just scrap it but its already been written and needs editing/working on to get me a pass grade
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Old 06-28-2008, 06:30 AM   #9
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I'm not sure this is a direct answer to Katharos' question but I wanted to make an observation. Why is it that when we talk about the goth scene we tend to forget gothic literature? Take Solumina's post for example;

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solumina
Goth is music and fashion, that is it. There is no belief system, no morals, and no attitude that should be associated with the subculture. That and it is a subculture, not a counterculture, people need to stop trying to make it more than it is.
I guess you could say goth has "no belief system, no morals, and no attitude" if you're only looking at the music and the clothing, but once you include gothic literature things change. Gothic literature from the late 1700s up until the Victorian era does lean towards certain morals and attitudes, and a good part of it carries into modern gothic fiction too. I don't really see how anyone can deny or plead ignorance of this unless you simply don't read gothic literature at all. We have a thriving literature section here; lots of Gnet members are readers, and some are authors. Maybe all the ads and spam on Gnet are about music, movies and clothing but that is simply because spammers are trying to sell us the superficial look without the ideas behind it. Notice that under the Gnet banner it says, "Bone Chilling Literary Culture". Music and clothing aren't mentioned.

Gothic literature does have a certain world-view or mindset (for lack of a better term). This mindset influenced the dark undercurrent of gothic music. Remember that the term "gothic rock" wasn't popularized by the bands themselves. It was a label applied by critics because they saw a similarity between these bands and earlier gothic themes. Bauhaus, Sisters of Mercy, The Cure, Fields of the Nephilim, and several other key gothic bands have always denied being gothic but the label stuck because the comparison between the music and the earlier literature was hard to deny.

I don't want to rant about what exactly the gothic mindset is because I don't have it well documented and, of course, different people will adhere to it to different degrees. I don't want to start a war about who is goth and who isn't. It's not a black and white thing but a large grey area and exceptions will be found. However, I think there is a gothic mindset behind both the literature and music and the parallels are clear once you're familiar with both. I've actually been researching this for a book of my own and I'd be interested in reading Katharos' thesis when it's done.
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Old 06-28-2008, 03:41 PM   #10
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That assumes that gothic literature is a part of the goth subculture, and it isn't. The reason that this site says "Bone Chilling Literary Culture" is because that was the origin of the site, when it was new the focus of the site was postings of short horror stories, the boards were something that became more of a focus as the site grew and changed.
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Old 06-28-2008, 04:36 PM   #11
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The goth subculture is simply a bunch of people who happened to be in allegiance or show favoritism to goth rock and deathrock.

It's like the Hippies, The modders, The rockers, The metalheads, The punks, you name them.

Sports fans. They're sports fans, except it has something to do with music instead of sports.

But, what I've come to understand is not those who happen to like the "sport" but happens to love the team and what they think it's about.

From my experience, a goth, usually, is one who seeks to be what is considered goth. They may find the elements associated with goth to be attractive on a surface level, but it's more about what they want people to think when people see them. This, I think, is what makes the steriotypes and becomes the considered norm of a bunch of people, who get represented by ill informed individuals who have nothing in common with the whole.

Goth, is mainly a product to be sold to those who want others to think that the consumer is dark and deep. Just like punk is a product.

Identities have become wholesale and prepackaged. Be it some interest in subcultures or even pop culture. It is all laid out in nice neat boxes that can be picked up off the shelves.

The only thing that can't be entirely prepackaged is what one can do for themselves. Your own ideas, your own efforts is the last thing that capitalism has yet to fully turn into a product.

In short, it is my understanding that a goth is a consumer of all things dark or morbid, who seek to have the social identity of goth. It's a status, just like everything else.
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Old 06-28-2008, 05:55 PM   #12
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Goth is not Gothic literature. That being said, if I really cared about what society thought and how goth, emo, punk, industrial, and hardcore death metal was portrayed, I wouldn't dress the way I dress, act the way I act, or like the things I like. Generally speaking, society looks down on those not wearing Old Navy 24-7 and those who don't sell/delete their CD's & mp3's if they fall off the Top 40. I don't care, therefore I am.


Oh, and welcome aboard!
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Old 06-29-2008, 10:23 AM   #13
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thank you to everyone whose posted so far! The actual title of my paper is "The Construction of Stereotypes in the Media Representation of Goth Culture" so you can kinda see where im coming from with my questions?
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