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Old 08-08-2011, 10:21 PM   #1
Renatus
 
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How not to protest:London

http://thedailywh.at/2011/08/07/tott...up/#more-46079
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Tottenham Riots News Round-Up: Riots erupted in the North London area of Tottenham last night, ostensibly over the recent shooting of 29-year-old Mark Duggan by the Metropolitan Police near Tottenham Hale station.

Duggan was reportedly a target of an ongoing police investigation into gun crime in London’s black communities, and was shot after allegedly firing on a Specialist Firearms Command officer with an illegal handgun.

A protest march organized by family and friends of Duggan turned violent after a rumor that police officers assaulted a teenage girl caused longstanding tensions to boil over. Many shops were looted and vehicles were set on fire, including two police cars and a double-decker bus. Several buildings sustained heavy damage after being petrol bombed by the rioters.

Duggan’s family said they did not condone the actions of the rioters and his brother asked that they refrain from “mak[ing] this about my brother’s life.”

When all was said and done, 55 people had been arrested, 29 were injured (26 officers and 3 others) and the London Fire Brigade had put out a total of 49 fires. All injured persons have since been released from hospital; the arrested remain in custody under various charges.

The Met has launched an investigation into the riot, and are asking anyone with information on those involved to get in touch. Police are also warning locals against “ill-informed speculation” posted on social networking sites concerning nascent riot activity taking place tonight in other parts of London. Additional rioting was reported in Wood Green and Enfield Town, where youths reportedly smashed store windows and attacked a police car.
Just goes to show the world could learn a thing or two about how to do a proper protest from Wisconsin. When we hold a protest we don't get violent, we get our point across, and we get the rest of the world's sympathy to the extent that they're willing to pay to keep the protesters fed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K576V...layer_embedded

Then again, we also make sure we're protesting something we have all the facts on.
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Old 08-08-2011, 10:25 PM   #2
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Yeah, and you lost that protest.
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You fucking people [war veterans] are only a step below entitled rich kids, the only difference being you had to do and witness horrible things, instead of being given everything.
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Old 08-09-2011, 02:35 AM   #3
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Those people rioting are just a bunch of dinlows. there's people coming from up north just to throw bricks at the police and torch buildings down. the police should just tazer gun the lot of them.
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Old 08-09-2011, 02:52 AM   #4
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Such a short sighted view by many here.

Strict austerity measures that have been rolled out over the past few years have made the poorest in the UK even more poverty stricken. The UK has been on a right-wing conservative roll, much like America, cutting social services, pensions, housing supplements, and other social services for the most vulnerable in society.

The people are already at the breaking point. Talk about no clue - the family of the shooting victim asking people not to riot on their behalf. Do they seriously think this is all about one mans shooting? It was merely the catalyst which brought the bigger issue to a head, much like the Rodney King shooting. The riots then were less about King and more about the living conditions. The same is true today.

Angry, impoverished people tend to react like this when all of their normal, daily pent up anger seeps out during certain flash points, like this one.

I'm just surprised it hasn't happened in the US yet...but it will.

It really bothers me to see others in the UK speak so harshly of their fellow countrymen. They have taken a page from the Americans on this one, establishing an 'us' and 'them' mentality with their own fellow countrymen who exist in pretty much the same tax bracket, ignoring the fact the people above both groups are the ones pulling the strings and are to blame.

You will get nowhere trying to demonise these people, as they are you and you are them. These are todays youths who have been told they will not be able to avail of free college tuition, even though every generation for the past few decades have done so. These are the people who have been told they will be losing needed health services because even though they work and pay taxes the government has decided to reroute that money elsewhere. These are the people who have no jobs and the government has decided to neglect yet at the same time is pumping billions into failed banks to keep the ultra rich afloat.

And people living there who are barely scraping by and are undoubtedly worse off now than every before have the audacity to cite their fellow countrymen for making a stand against such tyranny.
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Old 08-09-2011, 03:04 AM   #5
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http://tinyurl.com/3dbd4x9

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LONDON (AP) — A wave of violence and looting raged across London and spread to three other major British cities on Tuesday, as authorities struggled to contain the country's worst unrest since race riots set the capital ablaze in the 1980s.

In London, groups of young people rampaged for a third straight night, setting buildings, vehicles and garbage dumps alight, looting stores and pelting police officers with bottles and fireworks. The spreading disorder was an unwelcome warning of the possibility of violence for leaders organizing the 2012 Summer Olympics in less than a year.

Police called in hundreds of reinforcements — and made a rare decision to deploy armored vehicles in some of the worst-hit districts — but still struggled to keep pace with the chaos unfolding at flashpoints across London, in the central city of Birmingham, the western city of Bristol and the northwestern city of Liverpool.

Authorities acknowledged that major new bouts of violence had badly stretching their resources.

"The violence we have seen is simply inexcusable. Ordinary people have had their lives turned upside down by this mindless thuggery," police commander Christine Jones said.

The riots appeared to have little unifying cause — though some involved claimed to oppose sharp government spending cuts, which will slash welfare payments and cut tens of thousands of public sector jobs through 2015.

Others appeared attracted simply by the opportunity for violence. "Come join the fun," shouted one youth, racing along a street in the east London suburb of Hackney, where shops were attacked and cars torched.

The crisis will be a major test of Prime Minister David Cameron's coalition government, which includes members who had long suspected its program of harsh budget restraints could provoke popular dissent. He reversed an earlier decision and cut short his summer vacation in Italy, rushing home for a meeting of the national crisis committee on Tuesday morning.

Cameron was expected to seek to toughen the response in meetings with ministers and police chiefs.

Rioters were left virtually unchallenged in several neighborhoods and able to plunder from stores at will or attempt to invade homes. Restaurants and stores fearful of looting closed early across London.

Disorder flared throughout the night, from gritty suburbs along the capital's fringes to central London's famously posh Notting Hill neighborhood. London's Ambulance Service said it had treated 16 patients, of whom 15 were hospitalized. Police said 334 people had been arrested and 69 people charged with offenses.

Three people were arrested on suspicion of the attempted murder of a police officer left hospitalized after he was struck by a car in north London in the early hours of Tuesday.

After dawn, police said, the unrest appeared to calm, either quelled by police or after rioters drifted away.

Violence first broke out late Saturday in the low-income, multiethnic district of Tottenham in north London, where outraged protesters demonstrated against the fatal police shooting of Mark Duggan, a 29-year-old father of four who was gunned down in disputed circumstances Thursday.

A brief inquest hearing into Duggan's death will take Tuesday, though it will likely be several months before a full hearing is convened.

Duggan's death stirred old animosities and racial tensions similar to those that prompted massive riots in the 1980s, despite efforts by London police to build better relations with the city's ethnic communities after high-profile cases of racism in recent decades.

But, as the unrest spread, some pointed to rising social tensions in Britain as the government slashes 80 billion pounds ($130 billion) from public spending by 2015 to reduce the huge deficit, swollen after the country spent billions bailing out its foundering banks.

In the south London district of Croydon, police said a 26-year-old man was shot and seriously injured Monday but were unable to say immediately whether the incident was linked to rioting there.

A massive blaze ravaged a 100-year-old family run furniture store in Croydon and sent thick plumes of smoke into the air, forcing nearby homes to be evacuated. In the Clapham Junction area of south London, a mob stole masks from a party store to disguise their identities and then set the building on fire.

Sony Corp. said a major blaze had broken out at its distribution center near Enfield, north London, damaging stocks of DVDs and other products. So many fires were being fought in the capital that Thames Water, which supplies most of London, warned that some of its customers could see their water pressure drop.

Dozens of people attacked shops in Birmingham's main retail district, and clashed with police in Liverpool and Bristol.

In London's Hackney, hundreds of youths left a trail of burning trash and shattered glass. Looters ransacked a small convenience store, filling plastic shopping bags with alcohol, cigarettes, candy and toilet paper.

East London's diversity was on display amid the charred hulks of cars and the smell of burning plastic. Some looters were young women with manicured nails and customized BlackBerry smart phones. Others wore dreadlocks and stained shirts or appeared to be homeless.

"This is the uprising of the working class. We're redistributing the wealth," said Bryn Phillips, a 28-year-old self-described anarchist, as young people emerged from the store with chocolate bars and ice cream cones.

Phillips claimed rioters were motivated by distrust of the police, and drew a link between the rage on London's street and insurgent right-wing politics in the United States. "In America you have the tea party, in England you've got this," he said.

Some residents called for police to deploy water cannons to disperse rioters, or call on the military for support. They questioned the strength of leadership within London's police department — particularly after a wave of resignations prompted by the country's phone-hacking scandal.

The small groups of youths used text messages, instant messaging on BlackBerry phones and social media platforms such as Twitter to coordinate their attacks and stay ahead of the police.

Once the preserve of businesspeople, BlackBerry handsets are popular with teenagers, thanks to their free, fast instant messaging system. Blackberry's manufacturer, Research in Motion, said in a statement that it was assisting authorities in their investigation and "feel for those impacted by the riots in London."

Police were also monitoring Twitter, and warned that those who posted messages inciting the violence could face arrest.

About 100 young people clashed with police in the Camden and Chalk Farm areas of north London, smashing their way into a bicycle store and mobile phone shop.

In the Peckham district of south London, where a building was set ablaze along with a bus — which was not carrying passengers — onlookers said the scene resembled a conflict zone. Cars were torched in nearby Lewisham, and in west London's Ealing suburb the windows of each store along entire streets had been smashed.

"There's been tension for a long time. The kids aren't happy. They hate the police," said Matthew Yeoland, a 43-year-old teacher watching the unrest in Peckham. "It's like a war zone and the police weren't doing anything. There were too many people and not enough police."

Police said Duggan was shot dead last week when police from Operation Trident — the unit that investigates gun crime in the black community — stopped a cab he was riding in.

The Independent Police Complaints Commission, which is investigating the shooting, said a "non-police firearm" was recovered at the scene, and media reports said a bullet had been found in an officer's radio. However, the Guardian newspaper reported that the bullet in the radio was police-issue, indicating Duggan may not have fired at the officer.

Duggan's partner, Semone Wilson, insisted Monday that her fiance was not connected to gang violence and urged police to offer more information about his death. But she rejected suggestions that the escalating riots were linked to protests over his death. "It got out of hand. It's not connected to this anymore. This is out of control," she said.

The past year has seen mass protests against the tripling of student tuition fees and cuts to public sector pensions. In November, December and March, small groups broke away from large marches in London to loot. In the most notorious episode, rioters attacked a Rolls-Royce carrying Prince Charles and his wife Camilla to a charity concert.

However, the full impact of spending cuts has yet to be felt and the unemployment rate is stable — although it remains highest among youth, especially in areas like Tottenham, Hackney and Croydon.

Some people caught up in the unrest insisted that joblessness was not to blame. "It's just an excuse for the young ones to come and rob shops," said Brixton resident Marilyn Moseley, 49.

Police urged communities to help clear the streets of people, and called on families to contact their children and ensure that they were not involved in the chaos. An 11-year-old boy was charged with burglary by police, and at least 100 of those arrested were aged 21 or younger. About 35 police officers had been injured in the violence, police said.
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Old 08-09-2011, 03:06 AM   #6
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Home Secretary Theresa May, the Cabinet minister responsible for policing, and London Mayor Boris Johnson also cut short summer vacations in an attempt to deal with the crisis.

Police in Birmingham, 120 miles (195 kilometers) north of London, confirmed that officers had arrested 35 people amid disorder across the city center, where shops were being vandalized. In Bristol, police urged residents to avoid the city center after 150 rioters went on the rampage.

Tottenham was the site of the 1985 Broadwater Farm riots, a series of clashes that led to the fatal stabbing of a police officer and the wounding of nearly 60 others — and underscored tensions between London police and the capital's black community.

West Ham, a football team in east London, confirmed it had canceled a match planned for Tuesday as a precaution. However, the national Football Association insisted that a scheduled international friendly match between England and the Netherlands would go ahead at Wembley Stadium on Wednesday.

The International Olympic Committee insisted it had confidence in British authorities. "Security at the Olympic Games is a top priority for the IOC," spokesman Mark Adams said.
The media are actively trying to downplay the causes of the riots and make it look like random violence.
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Old 08-09-2011, 03:20 AM   #7
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as much as i agree some of the stuff you say sternn , there just isnt any reasonable explanation as to all the rioting. yes the country is extremely poor and yes college and university tuition is no longer free but i couldnt say what the kids are doing is just. when i say kids i mean as young as 8 years old.

im ashamed to be put in that group of no good youths - people from other countries and tourists are going to look at me now and asume im a no good thug because of whats happening.
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Old 08-09-2011, 03:24 AM   #8
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as much as i agree some of the stuff you say sternn , there just isnt any reasonable explanation as to all the rioting. yes the country is extremely poor and yes college and university tuition is no longer free but i couldnt say what the kids are doing is just. when i say kids i mean as young as 8 years old.

im ashamed to be put in that group of no good youths - people from other countries and tourists are going to look at me now and asume im a no good thug because of whats happening.
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage...-RSS&ATTR=News
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Old 08-09-2011, 07:16 AM   #9
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I am a bit curious how this affecting London's goth population, from what a quick google search has revealed, Camden has been affected by the riots. Then again I remember Delkaetre once said the goth venues moved a bit further up the road into another part of London, though from what I remember of a google maps search of the area , it wasn't very far up the road.


Speaking of Delkaetre, I hope she's ok.
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Old 08-09-2011, 08:38 AM   #10
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From what I've seen so far, these riots provide an excuse for some people to burn, loot and smash shit up, and for others to suck the polices' dicks and pretend their actions are ALWAYS exemplary.

On the one hand, you have the shooting of a man and the alleged beating of a young girl, in the wake of the proven police violence that took place at both the G20 protests and the cuts protests - and that's before you even get to the current government's blatant war against the poor. On the other, you have local business owners losing their livelihoods because the anger of the rioters is without focus or any will towards constructive action - and I have no doub that it is probably, in some cases, merely an excuse for violence.

Basically, as is usual in such situations, what you're left with is a fucking mess. I'm hoping emerging information will clarify a few things, not least the precise circumstances of the shooting that sparked the whole thing.

Oh, and let's not get smug about 'we know how to protest'. This isn't about the moral superiority of anyone's home town. So far, what I'm seeing in all this is that if you treat people like animals, they'll behave like them. It's the news equivalent of Native Son, not Jane bloody Eyre.
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Old 08-09-2011, 09:09 AM   #11
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Oh, and let's not get smug about 'we know how to protest'. This isn't about the moral superiority of anyone's home town. So far, what I'm seeing in all this is that if you treat people like animals, they'll behave like them. It's the news equivalent of Native Son, not Jane bloody Eyre.
Two things, 1 I don't do smug when violence is involved, and even when it isn't involved I really am not very good at it. 2 Look up the Vietnam protests that happened in Madison, they were treated like animals, brutally clubbed without any violence on the part of the students. One of the beaten students even eventually became mayor.
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“I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.”- Einstein
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Old 08-09-2011, 09:43 AM   #12
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You can't tell the multitude how to revolt.
Small businesses thrashed and looted are unfortunate events, but you can't just condemn the riots altogether because of its violence. You can't just look down and say "you're doing it wrong". It's a riot. It DOESN'T make sense. It's the manifestation of bottled up discontentment that wouldn't have happened if there WERE viable channels of dissent. But there aren't.
You're condemning a scorpion for stinging.
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You fucking people [war veterans] are only a step below entitled rich kids, the only difference being you had to do and witness horrible things, instead of being given everything.
real classy
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Old 08-09-2011, 10:13 AM   #13
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Two things, 1 I don't do smug when violence is involved, and even when it isn't involved I really am not very good at it. 2 Look up the Vietnam protests that happened in Madison, they were treated like animals, brutally clubbed without any violence on the part of the students. One of the beaten students even eventually became mayor.
Sorry, but I'm not sure I see your point here. Are you arguing that peaceful protests are more likely to make an impact in real terms than those involving violence?

'Cause if so - you know who really know how to get shit done? The French.Forget everything you thought you knew about the French and white flags. It’s actually a handy covering drape for their stash of petrol bombs. You fuck with their standard of living in a DREAM, you better wake up and apologise - and they've maintained one of the best in Europe in terms of retirement age, health care etc., because it's widely known among the French establishment that you DO NOT MESS. The whole 'violence gets you nowhere' ethos is bullshit.

Or, as William Burroughs put it, "The people in power will not disappear voluntarily, giving flowers to the cops just isn't going to work. This thinking is fostered by the establishment; they like nothing better than love and nonviolence. The only way I like to see cops given flowers is in a flower pot from a high window."
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Old 08-09-2011, 10:44 AM   #14
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They're careful to try and not piss off the white French born citizens. When Muslims riot, laws and persecution against them get harder.
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Old 08-09-2011, 11:16 AM   #15
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"But you don't have to protect yourselves from tribes of Native Americans on the war path or wild animals,there is no need for the population as a whole to own firearms"

Everytime I see the reports on the London riots I can't help but think of the blissninny's that couldn't see this happening.

*Does Tim the enchanter impression* "I warned you...but no you wouldn't listen...."it's only a wee bunny" HA!"
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Old 08-09-2011, 11:21 AM   #16
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They're careful to try and not piss off the white French born citizens. When Muslims riot, laws and persecution against them get harder.
Oh yeah, I'm not saying the French system is perfect - just that the idea that violence is inherently destructive to any given cause is erroneous.
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Old 08-09-2011, 11:29 AM   #17
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It depends on what your end goal is. To protect the interests of privileged, white citizens? Usually pretty easy. A total revolution? To do that violently I think you really need to have strong consensus and numbers, and I don't think those rioting in England right now have that.
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Old 08-09-2011, 11:44 AM   #18
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I wouldn't know how to formulate a workable idea of total revolution, and honestly, that wasn't really a point I was going for. But I do know that letting a copper batter you over the head without retaliating doesn't usually end in the injured party being made mayor. Peaceful protests are quite simply easier to ignore.
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Old 08-09-2011, 11:51 AM   #19
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The only goal in this "protest" seems to be looting and setting fires to homes and business.

In other words the ANARCHY so many of you asked for...so enjoy it dipshits.

You disarmed yourselves and trusted the police to protect YOU....what are the London police doing?

NOTHING ! ......... HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA!!!!!!

REAP IT !
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Old 08-09-2011, 11:51 AM   #20
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When you feed young people a diet of hopelessness, eventually they will lash out. That's what's happening in the UK.
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Old 08-09-2011, 11:52 AM   #21
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The only goal in this "protest" seems to be looting and setting fires to homes and business.

In other words the ANARCHY so many of you asked for...so enjoy it dipshits.

You disarmed yourselves and trusted the police to protect YOU....what are the London police doing?

NOTHING ! ......... HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA!!!!!!

REAP IT !
It started as a result of police shooting a man, you fucking fool. Shut up about things you don't understand.
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Old 08-09-2011, 11:55 AM   #22
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It started as a result of police shooting a man, you fucking fool. Shut up about things you don't understand.
You should follow your own advice dumbass


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Old 08-09-2011, 12:01 PM   #23
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If this all started because the police shot someone...and what has it turned into?

The ANARCHY that many on here wanted so badly.

HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-.....Fucking HA!
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Old 08-09-2011, 12:02 PM   #24
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So Alex Jones knows more about the riots than me, who knows people who've actually been there and seen it with their own eyes? Okay.
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Old 08-09-2011, 12:03 PM   #25
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I wouldn't know how to formulate a workable idea of total revolution, and honestly, that wasn't really a point I was going for. But I do know that letting a copper batter you over the head without retaliating doesn't usually end in the injured party being made mayor. Peaceful protests are quite simply easier to ignore.
Yeah, but we'll have to see the results of these riots to see if it was worth it, you know? If the police survive, and I expect they will, they'll probably just make life harder for everyone afterwards. I think to get rid of police you need a total revolution, because the state depends on them too much.

I don't blame people for being angry (although honestly its too confusing right now to get a picture of who are revolutionaries and who are just opportunists), I just don't think they are going to get what they want in the end.
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