Teens charged in alleged plot to kill students
 

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/07/13/sho...ies&eref=yahoo

NEW YORK (CNN) -- Police said a teenager wrote in a journal, "I will start a chain of terrorism in the world," and outlined a plot to detonate a bomb and kill students at his high school in Bohemia, New York.

Long Island authorities arrested a 15-year-old and a 17-year-old identified as Michael McDonough, Friday on charges of conspiring to attack staff and students.

Police said McDonough and the 15-year-old worked at a McDonald's, where the journal was discovered by an adult in the parking lot.

The journal was passed to school administrators July 6.

Officials said the 15-year-old, who was on a long-term suspension from the school in Bohemia, is believed to be the primary author of the journal. McDonough, who attended a Long Island high school, was set to help carry out the alleged plans, authorities said.

Suffolk County Police Commissioner Richard Dormer said the journal described shooting students and setting off homemade explosions.

Police said a search warrant was issued for the 15-year-old's computer, where it was discovered that he'd made numerous attempts and inquires on the Internet to obtain weapons, including an Uzi and five pounds of black powder explosive.

Police found several videotapes in which the 15-year-old appeared. Dormer described them as "chilling."

He also said the plans were very elaborate. One of the videotapes was at least 10 minutes long.

The two suspects were to be arraigned Friday.


So a 15 year old McDonalds worker has a personal journal which in it he writes how much he hates the other kids at school. They use this as a basis for a warrant to raid his home, seize his computer, where they find he googled 'uzi', and then use that information to arrest him.

Anyone else think this is a stretch? How many people didn't like the people in their high school? How many had a diary and wrote this? Does that make you a 'terrorist'? In America today, it does.

Don't like your schoolmates? Well, your obviously in need of re-conditioning, so ship em off to prison for thought training. How dare a kid not get along with other kids.

And searching his PC for what he googled? I mean, if googling a term now counts as probable cause in America, the judicial system is screwed. Think of everything you have ever searched for on the net - now think that the government is going to monitor that and have you arrested based on what they deem inapropriate.

Seriously, do they think a 15 year old working at McDonalds is going to be able to actually purchase an UZI? It's a class 3 weapon in America, meaning you have to have a few different licenses. On top of that, they run a few grand. Even if say a child was able to forge all the documents, somehow hack the national database and get past all the background checks, where is he going to get the $3000-$4000 needed for the purchase?

I could google 'A1 Tank', doesn't mean I'm a terrorist that will be driving down main street next week in one.

Anyone else bothered by the fact now any child who appears different or unique gets branded as a potential terrorist and is arrested, told their thoughts and views are wrong, and then are re-programmed by the government to believe whatever it is they are selling them?

Oh come off it, what with all the school shootings and what not happening, they'd be morons to not look into it. For all you know, the kid could have actually GOTTEN said munitions and gone on a fucking rampage, same as what's happened before, and WILL happen again!

...or revise the bloody gunlaws.

By the way, here in Sweden a uzi from the black market costs around.. say.. $150. Ammunition included. In a triggerhappy nation like America it's probably even easier to get one.

At first glace it seems stupid for a 15-year-old to be arrested under suspicion of terrorism, but there truely HAVE been school shootings. You never know how whacked the kid might be.
A journal and a few inquieries over the internet seem pretty lame evidence, especialy knowing this is a teen-aged kid...And yet, he could be serious. I hope the authorities don't ruin this kid's life incase he didn't really mean it. They should have a psychologist have a look at him and interview friends before they actualy go around saying he was planning a school massacre.

Seriously, do they think a 15 year old working at McDonalds is going to be able to actually purchase an UZI? It's a class 3 weapon in America, meaning you have to have a few different licenses. On top of that, they run a few grand. Even if say a child was able to forge all the documents, somehow hack the national database and get past all the background checks, where is he going to get the $3000-$4000 needed for the purchase?

Be careful how you throw out how hard it is to get a weapon. You have to realize that gun control policies only keep weapons out of the hands of people willing to abide by the laws.

During the Columbine shootings, the most deadly weapons (had they worked) wouldn't have been their weapons. They had simple pistols, rifles, and shotguns. Their most devastating weapons would have been two homemade propane bombs (once again, had they worked).

It's not unfathomable that researching guns could have been used to commit the acts. The Uzi is, by most standards, a pretty simple firearm. I'm not saying the kid is going to be walking out there with a fully automatic FN f2000 and high end optics, but the Uzi is an entirely different story.

But back to the issue.

These kids don't need to be punished. They have a problem with society, so instead of putting them for trial, try finding out why they have a problem.

Maybe instead of arresting him they should get him a phyciatrist =\

That makes me hesistant.

Why?

Because Psychiatry can lead to Teen Camps.
Teen Camps lead to a feeling of hell, and brainwashing.

That's the last thing I could ever want for a kid. I've always had this fantasy where they'd take me into a teen camp, one of those outdoor ones, and I would destroy the entire thing. They scare me that much.

... Teen camp? O_o

Ever watch the series Brat Camp?
That's a glorified version of what goes on.

Basically, they break you down and build you back up. Some places can be extremely terrifying, and have even resulted in the deaths of those who attend.

Woah... I've never watched the series... maybe I should =\

Duck -

First, no one ever said they shouldn't 'look into' it. But raiding their homes and arresting them on what can be called at best circumstantial evidence, I mean, there is no evidence of a crime, intentions to commit a crime, or even any real ability to commit a crime. At best you have an angry teen who wrote something angry in his personal journal. Arriagning him on terrorism charges is insane.

Methadrine -

Also not deying that you can buy guns cheap in some areas on the blackmarket. That being said, this kid lived in upstate New York, in a small country hick town. They have no underworld. They only have a handful of traffic lights in the whole town. There would be no place to find a hot uzi no matter how hard they tried. On top of this, kids who could get access to an uzi don't go googling it on the internet - the go to the local hang/crime areas and buy one, furthering my point this child was less than the threat they have made him to be.

And finally, for those who brought up brat camp and the like, thats exactly what I was on about. Back in the dark points of the Soviet era, people were whisked away to 're-education' centres when they had thoughts or ideas that were deemed to be dangerous to their way of life (readin: brainwashing).

In the 80's during the Cold War I remember all the shows, pamplets, and other assorted shite they sold on on the news and in the classrooms about how this sort of thing is bad and keeps people under control and is what happens in a dictatorship.

Here it is just a few decades later and we see the exact same practice, now banned in the new Russian Federation, appearing in America - the country that for years rallied against this exact practice, now done for the exact same reasons - 'protection of the people'.

It doesn't end with 'brat camps', our whole judicial system is geared towards changing people to fall in line. The prison system itself, aside from being a huge trillion dollar money making industry is now used to re-education anyone who goes against the will of certain persons or groups.

Just seems to be a trend that started a while back and is now really gaining momentum. It's spread from adults to children who are now being taken away younger and younger for less and less to be 'taught' how to behave in todays society (i.e. told how they should act).

Well, I reckon they'd look pretty dumb if this kid shot up his school, and the cops were all "Well, gee, guys, we DID kinda know about this, but we figured 'Meh, he's a just little angry' and let him go."

Even if a brat camp = brainwashing, I think it's better sending him there than setting trial against him for being a potential terrorist when he was just an angry teen.

The problem with this, and I actually have a personal stake in this, is that if you have ever walked on the non-conventional side in school, if you've ever had a reputation of being a gun-nut and not a republican, if you've ever thought about how your teacher can scream at you, and if you scream back it's assualt, you're at risk to go to these places.

They can completely destroy a person, and make it so they're just a shell of what they once were. It tells them up is down, left is right, and that they have no right to question what the big man in camouflage is screaming at them for.

To me, it's terrifying not only because of the physical pain, but of being so controlled, twisted, and warped, you're told what to think.

I never thought such a place would be a piece of cake...by what you say souds like A Clockwork Orange...
And yet being chucked into jail or just the fact of being tried for what you never did must suck just as much, especially that it will ruin your chances of getting a normal job once you're out.
Being stuck between the devil and the deep blue sea, so to speak, i am wondering what would be worse for the kid?

I don't know. And honestly, I can't think of an alternative.

I just know from a bit of personal experience, and other horror stories that these camps can be nightmares. Even the little taste that I had, that was over 2 years ago, and I went voluntarily (At first), was able to get out of, still wakes me up in the middle of the night.

They need to focus more on counciling and less on incarceration. This is not just for teens and children, this is a policy that needs to be implemented across the states.

Before arresting and arraigning him, he should have been sent for psychiatric evaluation and have them determine if he is a threat, and have a few follow up meetings to make sure he is not a danger to others.

Thats how they handle this sort of thing across Europe.

The problem is, America is a prison state. It has more prisons than any other country in the history of the world and has more persons incarcerated than any country in the history of mankind. That is per capita as well as in sheer numbers.

Counciling doesn't pay off like prisons do. Anyone ever watch that episode of The Simpsons where Mr. Burns buys a prison and needs to fill it? Although a cartoon, thats a simplified version of what is happening at prisons across America.

Expect more children to be arrested for far less in the future.