Pandora's Box *Submissions here*
 

Welcome to Pandora's Box!

I started going through this forum, reading various submissions, however some entries are old and have, most likely, since been edited, so I have decided the best way for me to be of help is to open my own thread for those who want my advice.

But first I feel it necessary to do a backstory dump.

I have been editing horror, dark fantasy & high fantasy for over four years. I operate my own business that offers various editorial service such as proofreading, copy-editing, article writing, authorship validation etc. I have written a few short stories and some poetry and I am currently working on my first novel. Since I have 4 months off from study, I am using the NaNoWriMo challenge to help me get my book finished. Nex year I will start my university career and I aim to obtain a Master's in Editing and Publishing so I can open my own Publishing house which will cater to horror, dark fantasy and high fantasy (NO OPRAH'S BOOK CLUB SUBMISSIONS WILL BE ACCEPTED!!!)

That's me in a nutshell.

What I am offering is advice on short submissions (poetry, short stories and novel fragments). If you want it proofread, copy-edited etc. please email me privately and I will give you a quote. I am honest and if you don't handle constructive criticism well, then please DO NOT POST HERE!!!!

Again, this thread is for those who want an honest, professional opinion with constructive advice!!!

Now let's get this party started. Who's first?

Jules

I am....I am working on several horror novels and need some insight on the first chapter.....

That is the funniest thing I've read all goddamn year!!!

Thanks.

Are you trying to be an asshole on purpose?

Hey...Leave Tstone alone (that rhymes) HE TEH MAN!

Well, he didn't have to come up and insult me for speaking my mind, did he?

Why yes, it is what I'm known for.

...

But it is goddamn funny. I'd not lie about that.

Usually it's best to write the novels, edit the work to the best of your ability, prior to seeking the help of an editor. I mean, that is the way the rest of us do it. Perhaps you should find a Ghostwriter instead of an editor?

Yes. Even my Magic Asshole (tm) says, "Definitely so."

Oh, now I understand. I see what you mean....if you had said that in the first place, I wouldn't have said anything...I thought you were laughing at me...

And no offense, but could a moderator move this thread to shill?

I guess........

I’d be lying if I didn’t say this thread DID NOT disturb me. I’ve been refraining from engaging you, Juliet, in the hopes your intentions were good. Many of us here are professional, semi-professional, and aspiring writers. We are consistently preyed upon by less than savory self-promoting monetary appropriating filches, and so if I come across as skeptical?

I’ve good reason.

The fact is many would-be writers are damn fine line editors, copy editors, content editors, and proof readers. I, myself, have performed this labor of love many times, and I’m damn good at it.

Don’t take my word for it? Then ask any one who has received a line by line edit from me.

This is the thing. I’m protective of my peers and of this craft I love. I take the art of writing, serious. And I’ve been expecting a post, similar to the one you’ve created here, since first you arrived and gave a token opinion concerning a story which shouldn’t even be called a story, while promoting (secreted within those comments) an anterior agenda.

I’m a good editor, and can read between the lines.

So here we are, and you’ve finally gotten to it. For a small fee you will provide professional edits to we would-be writers. Your credentials are, you’ve read a lot of words, and you own your own professional company. You’ve gone to school.

Yippee-skippy.

This is the thing, what makes you any different than the other thousands of lowbred fucktards out there claiming the same goddamn thing? I’d like to give you the benefit of the doubt, I really want to like you, but since you are asking for money (and I can’t doubt you for wanting to be a successful editor and I can even dig you’d need to get paid for your efforts) but why should we come off our hard earned dollars to allow you the privilege to edit our work?

Hmmm?

At this end of the writing spectrum an in-house editor is like Ponce de Leon’s fountain of youth, nonexistence. Instead we have options of trading our work with other writers, or to opt out for a free-lance such as yourself. I’m not cozying up to the idea of my fellow writers getting screwed, yet again, by a High Apple Pie In The Sky confidence woman.

You’ll have to pardon me, I see sharks everywhere.

My actual question, finally I get to the damn thing, is…what is that lovely scent you are wearing? Is it, perhaps, Legitimacy…or perhaps, Ooohaha, by Sharkbait? Questioning minds want to know.

Well said, mon ami.....

I agree specifically when you stated the fact that anyone can be a good editor, but this guy is a joke...is he seriously asking for money?

Thing is, you've got to start somewhere and build a client list. I'm not calling Juliet a filch, yet. I'd like to believe in her. So far, though, I haven't seen those traits and tells that would leave me with a positive feeling.

Which is why I asked her to further explain her intentions.

Okay, but that doesn't answer my question....and would it be too much trouble if I ever ask you for some insight on a chapter or something?

Lord Dagon,

I’ve become selective on who I will edit. I just do not have the time or luxury of editing and reading every piece that comes my way. It doesn’t leave me any time for my own work.

I do, however, still trade in edits for edits. My criteria for that is the writer has to be near my level, willing to piss me off with blunt force honesty, and able to receive the same blunt force honesty in return.

I will not give anyone any advice on where a story should go, how to start it off, plot elements, or anything of that ilk. My reasoning for this is simple. If you are the writer, then write, goddamnit. With that said, I also abhor pitch sessions. I can only give you my honest opinion if, and only if, I can read the damn thing. I do not let people read my unfinished work, and I do not ask others what they think of an idea I have for a story or novel before it is written. It’s presumptuous on my part, and on you, if you ask me or someone else to do so.

Just write it, and then, after it’s finished, ask for opinions. Even if it sucks, even if it’s the worse fucking story in the whole goddamn world, you benefited by writing it, and learned from the experience.

I do, quite frequently, practice the pro bono methodology of giving back to the writing community, and if I see someone has an exceptional disposition toward the craft, I will go out of my way to nurture and encourage them with edits, insights, submission recommendations, introduce them to my networking list, give sexual favors, by drinks, co-sign a loan…I’ll give you the shirt off my back to keep you motivated and keep you writing.

The easiest way to elicit those good graces from me is to write something thought provoking, original, and impress me with a genuine hunger for the craft. If you do that you’ll not have to ask me, I’ll hunt you out…and beg for the opportunity, the privilege, to help.

I hope that answers your question.

In All Sincerity,
Thomas Stone

Heh, I understand better.
Forgive my asking, Mr. Stone (Mr. Thomas Stone). I will keep writing my stuff, I will criticize it myself, and if I'm fucking lucky enough, I'll publish it myself.
The reason for my asking was just for the simple purpose of seeing what the people like, but then again, who cares what the people like?
I feel that if I publish something because I like it, the so be it. You have made me realize that I should not be letting others do my work for me, I will do my own work, and, as the saying goes, all the blood, sweat and tears will make it all worth while....
Thank you, Mr. Stone (Mr. Thomas Stone, I think that's quite healthy, don't you?) for giving me the space to do this on my own....

-Dagon (Lord Dagon.....Mr. Thomas Stone)

If I may be so bold as to say something.

I offered advice on small pieces at no charge. I stated that if you want a line by line break down of your masterpiece, then I will charge. Like you TStone I have edited for many others out of the kindness of my heart and for the love of the craft. Many times I have had novels dumped in my lap with the "I value your opinion, could you please take a look at this for me?" At the end of it, it had cost me time and money.

I imagine that after reading my advice on the small section that I am sent, that the author would then go and action it, edit their own work, re-write it or whatever. I am making it clear that if you want me to edit a novel, then I will charge you. I am not holding a gun to anyone's head here. I can look over something and offer my opinion. If that's where it ends, so be it. I love what I do and if no-one wants my opinion then that's fine. I applaud your good intentions TStone, but please don't paint me with the same synical brush as you paint others. I am happy to have a dialogue with you on this for as long as you like until you are satisfied of my intentions.

For everyone else, my offer stands. I will look over small pieces, but if you wants me to look over something large, I will charge you. If all you are after is some Q & A advice, I am more than willing to help.

As always, the choice is yours. If everyone feels this is inappropriate, then by all means, delete the thread. If anyone wants my advice after that, all they have to do is ask.

TSone, the floor is yours. I await your rebuttal.

Jules

I know the reason for your asking, I’ve been around this proverbial tree enough to smell fresh sap when it’s proffered. And you asked if I was willing, and I thought I said (at this time) I was not, ever so nicely, and even gave reasons for the why.

Had you asked who would be willing, instead, I’d have said seek out a critique group, or find some like-minded folks at your current level, and jump in.

As for who cares what people like, you should. There are naysayers who will disagree with me on this, but it all comes down to semantics. You write for yourself and in the back of your head you hope something you write clicks with someone else, and so you only write for yourself by proxy, because at the time of the writing there is no one else.

Which is why it’s such a lonely profession. Which is also why so much of the burden falls to the writer. You have a lot of hats to wear, aside from the author’s hat you have the editor’s hat, the fan and anti-fan hat, the publisher’s hat, agent’s hat, shill’s hat, and all those hats will just about cover the author’s swollen ego, and keep him or her from looking like a complete ass in the eyes of Joe Public.

But you’ve got the right idea, and the only way you can become a writer is to start…writing. Good luck.

p.s. you can call me Stone, or Tom. The Mr. bit is only for those few, select individuals who’ve pissed me off, and you’ve not (yet) gotten there. Also, you may want to try your local library for critique groups. If that fails there are a bajllion critique groups you can join online. I highly recommend the process of communal critiquing. Not only does it give you experience in editing and proofing, it helps one develop a thick skin and allows you better objectivity toward your own work. Plus you get to meet people. Sometimes they even have free doughnuts and weed.

Heh, maybe I was a bit too rough.
Yeah, maybe some people wanrt advice on what they're writing, and some people don't. Your opinion isn't the only one, and therefore isn't always the right one. Just because an author sells, it doesn't make him a good author. Sometimes people don't want opinions, and some do.
I'm speaking my mind here when I say that I prefer not to get opinions anymore. Sometimes it makes the whole difference....sometimes not...
-Dagon (Lord Dagon.....do I need to say more?)

In closing...
 

One final point I feel I should mention. I stated very clearly that I will charge for large pieces. If I was dubious or underhanded in anyway I would have omitted that from my offer and then stung the poor suspecting writer like others I have come across.

Again the floor is open.

Jules

I don't see what the quarrel is between the two of you...
TStone, you and Juliet have made good points, but this is insane.
Let Juliet charge and give criteria if he (or she) desires. TStone, keep making your points, yet Juliet will strike back, and it might never end..

I have no quarrel, I am just making my intentions clear as requested. He has every right to question me if he so desires.

And for the record I am a she.

Jules

Thanks, anyway, just keep going, then....

An offering
 

Perhaps an offering on my part...

Closed windows, books and coffins.


There is no light in this death,
No heart to hold my hand, no vision of hope seen.
I swallowed the pain you so carefully sent,
Grieving my death before my time.
All shallow words screamed, all whispers of love hidden.
A maniacs mind has set upon me,
No substantial echoes,
Only empty memories reguritated
As a reminder to my life, my pain,
A scrapbook of missing pages.

No knowledge in this death,
No lessons learnt here, no sentimental reflections,
Only a corpse to mark my torment.
All that I own in ashes,
All that I was dismembered.
My spirit spent and wasted on the vile creatures I call my own.
Even at my death, you offer no love,
Only a coffin and a bad suit
And curses against my memory, my name,
And a gravestone that has known more love and care than I.


Your thoughts please?