[Raza]

Originally Posted by Versus

That's weird. Because consistently since the American draft was abolished, it has stayed that way. Overwhelmingly so. Periodic polls have indicated this and every time someone suggests bringing it back, the decision reflects those polls.

So representative democracy works out when people already mostly agree, and you're with that majority opinion. That's not really much to boast.

I'm not saying that drafts aren't affected by votes. They are. But no individual voter has any real power over how their lives are affected, even if all votes added up have some value to counterpoint the power of politicians. And I know that that's 'just how the system works'; that's why I'm saying it's a sucky system.

Nation States are a crappy model for community organization and way too bloody big for this kind of thing, but when people thought of democracy they never bothered changing the borders they inherited from their kings and imperialistic tyrants. 'Rule of the people' is a very good idea, but we have it half-arsedly implemented at best.

Originally Posted by Versus

There is an explanation for that.

Of course there is, but that doesn't make it a good thing. It's a nice article, but it doesn't really favor the US democratic system.

Originally Posted by Versus

It's called change. It happens sometimes. And every time I hear that word, I think of this.

I'm not sure that we're talking about the same thing here. 'Change' does not describe what I was talking about in any way that I can see.

Originally Posted by Versus

A government doesn't give anything to it's citizens, huh? I don't have any idea how we could continue if you seriously believe that.

I'm not saying it never 'gives anything' for what it takes - I'm saying that the government decides what it gives and what it takes, and the individual is simply subjected to that decision. It is one-sided in that it is not mutually decided upon, not in that the benefits and services go purely one way (although that's heavily slated too).

Originally Posted by Versus

Do you expect a country to vote on everything every time someone becomes old enough to do it? I'd hate to live in India.

Of course not. But I am expecting you to acknowledge that a draftee that has never voted cannot be said to have had a say in the matter on that account.

You're looking at this from a 'if you can't fix it, don't bash it' perspective. That is often constructive, to a degree. But you do have to acknowledge the limitations of your system, even if you don't know how to improve it. 'Democracy' isn't true or false in a binary sense; it is achieved or not achieved to varying degrees. Your system (and ours, too) achieves very little of it, so its existence carries equally little relevancy to the ethics of a draft.