The diminishing understanding of the Gothic roots.

[Victor "Rilvor" Leonard]

We don't even have a club here. Plenty in the surrounding states, but my online search yielded none. So I suppose I can't really put any (valuable) input here.

[Mir]

Bm - GDim - EDim - D in ya mouf!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[HateCulture]

im sick of this too - all the fake goths who pretend that they actually know all about it and think that they can lecture me about how Evenecence ect are really orginal and how I should want to marry Amy Lee.
seriously. It gets on every last Damn nerve I have.
And being a teenager on a day to day basis I still see "scenekids" getting classed as Goths and I don't understand why because although there are some small similarities in my opinion they are totally different.

[Tam Li Hua]

Instead of hating these kids for misunderstanding a genre that started WAY before they were born and has mostly grown underground rather than above it, why not try educating them first?

So the little scenester kids with spiky hair think Evanescence is Goth. Does it really matter that much? Geez, not even the "true" Goth icons recognize the term: Peter Murphy, Siouxsie Sioux, Robert Smith, etc. all HATE being called "Goth", as far as I know.

Just listen to what you like, and spread it around to folks you think could share in the gloriously dark musical candy.

[D0PPLEGANGER]

Reading the OP made me bleed from my ears.

[D0PPLEGANGER]

Originally Posted by HateCulture

im sick of this too - all the fake goths who pretend that they actually know all about it and think that they can lecture me about how Evenecence ect are really orginal and how I should want to marry Amy Lee.
seriously. It gets on every last Damn nerve I have.
And being a teenager on a day to day basis I still see "scenekids" getting classed as Goths and I don't understand why because although there are some small similarities in my opinion they are totally different.

Shut the fuck up retard. You are EMO!!

[Anarasha]

Originally Posted by D0PPLEGANGER

Shut the fuck up retard. You are EMO!!

And how do you know that she is emo?

[Emerald]

Originally Posted by Cicero

Considering where the name came from (there's a test question for all you 'gothic roots' fanatics!)'

Hmm let me see. Could it have been because Andi Sexgang's nickname was Count Visigoth due to his rather flamboyant style, and apparently friends would refer to his apartment as 'Visigoth Towers', and then the fans of Sexgang Children just came to be referred to as 'Goths' in reference to the Count Visigoth nickname of the lead singer...which might or might not have first been mentioned circa 1982/83 by Ian Astbury of Southern Death Cult/Death Cult/The Cult fame.

Or something like that anyway. It's 4 am here so I might have got a few things muddled up.

Can I have my Official Goth Roots Fanatic membership card now please.

*grin*

[Emerald]

Originally Posted by Solumina

Stop taking everything so fucking seriously, it takes the fun out of everything and people like you make the scene suck.

Yeah this, basically. My main issue with the whole "I hate the poseurs ruining the scene because *insert reason no. umpteen dozen and one* is because it's verging on taking this all way too seriously. I do agree it can be annoying to see the mainstream media putting out their stereotyped images, and reports, and then kids thinking being Goth means you have to folow some set of ultimate rules of Gawth about how to apply your eyeliner, and practice looking apathetic and disaffected. *note the sarcasm* But, you know, so long as those same kids aren't all up in my face, pulling a Gother Than Thou attitude, it's not exactly like I'm gonna start waving my walking stick at them and screaming, "Damn kids, get off lawn."

Really, in a way, this whole, you're a poseur, you're not a 'real' Goth if you don't do/say/dress/act etc whatever way a 'real' Goth is supposed to, is the antithesis of what the early Goth scene was supposedly trying to achieve.

Goth was never supposed to take itself seriously. From my understanding at least, the Goth scene formed out of the remnants of an increasingly commercialised punk scene. Some of the those people who had been part of the original punk movement wanted to get back that sense of irreverence, and fun, and irony, and 'do it yourself' type attitude. It was never meant to be this big elite club where only the worthy were allowed to join, and lay claim to the title. If you look at some of the old footage, and pictures of the Batcave there are all sorts of people there. Punks, new romantic types, people in just plain old jeans and t-shirt, people who were more dressed up in a darkly artistic way. And it was all good. You didn't have the Goth Police raiding the clubs to check to make sure someone's hair was just the right shade of black, and their shirt had the correct number of ruffles on it.

Basically, this is what the 'Goth Scene' is to me. A musical subculture based around a style of music, that developed out the British Punk scene in the late 70's. Everything else is secondary to that. If you're a fan of, and listen to the music of the subculture, then you're a Goth. Regardless of whether you shop at Hot Topic, and happen to own a few Evanescence CD's in your collection.

Some may disagree, of course. This is just my opinion.

[Tam Li Hua]

*claps*

Very well said, Emerald.

[Given_Flesh_by_Sophia]

people don't even think to mention Apoptygma Berzerk, Skinny Puppy, Zeromancer, The Mission (U.K.), Specimen, or the Danse Society... f***in' sad, that is...

________________________________

An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind

Mahatma Gandhi

[Ben Lahnger]

Crap! And here it looked like this thread was dead. Dammit!

There is no need for another one of these threads ... the previous 10 were useless.

Two points.

1) The dilution, distortion and lessening of the subculture was inevitable with the expansion of media and internet access. When cable TV first arrived on the scene, most people complained that it would cause a bunch of crap channels to go on the air. And there is truth in that, but at the same time in the hundreds of channels I now have access to I can definitely find things of interest much more easily. I just make it a point to avoid and ignore the stupid and the oblivious.

So many sub-subculture genres have splintered off, good and bad, to make the history and meaning of the main less important. There was a time when subcultures had more relevance. Not so much now. But it's a good time to enjoy what you enjoy, dress the way you want to dress and follow what you want to follow without regard to what neophytes, media or the world think. So stop making these useless threads.

2)

Originally Posted by Still Jack

I stopped going to clubs because they always seem to be full of retards that possess a special kind of social incompetence.

Good point, but that's true of all clubs and scenes. And you and I might disagree over what is required for social competence. Social incompetence is on the rise overall due to people not being forced to go out to seek entertainment and interaction. In fact, this thread and this forum are part of the problem.

o-0

[Anarasha]

You are right Ben. At the time I made this post, I was really angry at just about everything. It is indeed not a whole lot of good.
The recent increase in thread necromancers on GNet is annoying me slightly though o.o

[TrivialMorose]

Originally Posted by Anarasha

I had a guy come up to me and tell me he was Goth, so interrested, I asked him about what goth bands he liked. Then he said Evanescense, HIM and Marilyn Manson. Then I called him a poseur, and he wanted to hit me, but he was too drunk and almost fell.
People like that annoy me.

If this story was true, which I absolutely do not believe it is, then you sort of would have deserved to get some sense knocked into you. Not really, nobody deserves that, ever. But sort of.

You called a dude poser, to his face, for not liking the same bands you did.

Can you even hear how this sounds?

Well, this was obviously a fabricated story though, because nobody really talks this moronically outside of the internet. A little hyperbole on something that actually happened to you on a forum, eh?

Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, "Buh, buh, my gowthurz bands are teh realz"... You aren't a real ordained scene police officer, nobody ever gave you a badge, get over yourself.

Originally Posted by Anarasha

The recent increase in thread necromancers on GNet is annoying me slightly though o.o

Hahaha... So lucky you aren't here to see this necromancer work his foul magic on this dead boat! It's like the end of the Poltergeist in here these days! Remember when those caskets sprout out of the ground and spit corpses at the car of the main characters? (or something like that)

Overall, you were pretty goddamned easily annoyed, weren't you?

, I miss all of you guys...


Fuck, I talk such stupid shit with these desiccated old corpses, on the stupidest threads possible. Somebody save me from myself before it's too late... I can't do it alone...

These (death) rocks are so heavy...

[THEUNQUIETGRAVE]

This definitely rings very true.

In fact I only recently learned that the "Mall goths" and other types we used to call them, have taken on an entirely new identity known as "e-girls" and "e-boys".

We now literally have these so-called "Goths" literally calling others "Poseurs" while they themselves don't listen to any Goth Music!

Even in my area and others I've seen online, "Jazz" and "Hip-Hop" are even considered the "New Goth". Or they think that "Grimes" and "Billie Eilish" are "Goths / Goth Music" when they couldn't be further from it, what I consider to be "Bubble-gum Pop / Music".

You have to watch and listen to this video for example, the girl doesn't even listen to Goth bands but has it set in her mind who is a poseur:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EclQgatEOvU

I wish I were making all of this up.

Here even in Massachusetts where I live, there are other Goths in my area who've been even trying to start up conversations with others at bars or events where they don't even know who Siouxsie Sioux or the Sisters of Mercy are, they don't care who Rozz Williams was, and then there are some who pay no respects whatsoever to the other Old Classics which spun out of the Post-Punk and Death Rock style to begin with and might claim to hate it if they ever listened to any of it, but still go around claiming they're "Goths".

Apparently, the new thing which I've seen in the last few years is wearing a "NIRVANA" Shirt calling yourself "Goth", while they are both not even Goth, and actually don't even know who Nirvana is and don't even listen to them either, even though it's grunge!

So you really can't even connect with most people anymore or to even feel that confidence that they may likely be into the similar music tastes you are, and not only that, but they aren't even close to it either.

In these sad times, even Evanescence and Nightwish would be at least one step towards the direction even though it doesn't make the cut, but now in the 2020's, it doesn't even come that close.

In the 90's, when I got into Goth Music, the kids around me were not listening to Goth bands like myself and my other friends were, but were considering that bands like "Korn, Godsmack, Slipknot, etc." as "Goth Music".

So a lot has degraded even from the time of when this post thread had started.

[morbidforest]

I understand where you are coming from and there is certainly a lot of misunderstanding, but that's how people are. I avoid people like that.

Personally, it bothers me more when people listen to real goth, but dress in a different style, so people dismiss them straight away. Goth is a music based subculture : )