Blacks scapegoated for Prop.8 passage

viscus · 11-09-2008, 10:47 PM

Californian African-Americans, who at the polls some 70% of which voted to ban gay marriage under Prop. 8, seem to be facing a backlash from the LGBT community.

Quote:

Geoffrey, a student at UCLA and regular Rod 2.0 reader, joined the massive protest outside the Temple of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Westwood. Geoffrey was called the n-word at least twice.

"It was like being at a klan rally except the klansmen were wearing Abercrombie polos and Birkenstocks. YOU ******, one man shouted at men. If your people want to call me a ******, I will call you a ******. Someone else said same thing to me on the next block near the temple...me and my friend were walking, he is also gay but Korean, and a young WeHo clone said after last night the ******s better not come to West Hollywood if they knew what was BEST for them."

full article

I remember reading at article some years ago about how homophobia is lot stronger within the African-American and Latino communities. Aside from religiosity, it seems that many of them figure that they already have one stripe against them for being minorities, they don't need another by having homosexuals in their midst.

Regardless, it looks like things are getting pretty ugly.

Lolly PopMuzik · 11-09-2008, 11:04 PM

Lawdhammercy.

It's just shitty reading this given the history of our fight against the ban of interracial marriage and reading coverage that my own people willfully used spirituality and religion to both oppress another group and allow the woman who fought bitterly for our right to legally cross the color lines of love in matrimony to do a serious spin cycle in her own grave.

Lolly PopMuzik · 11-09-2008, 11:19 PM

Since my edit's up, I'd like to hope that there's an effort in the works to reverse the tide so that Mildred Loving's grave spinning will not turn her into a new power generator.

x-deviant-x · 11-09-2008, 11:41 PM

I don't know how to word my response to this, but I definitely have one.

There's arguments within the community that suggests if so many blacks hadn't been inspired to vote for obama, then they wouldn't have been at the polls to cast their votes in support of prop 8, or amendment 2 here in FL, etc. I tend to agree, but they aren't the only ones to blame.

There's also arguments over how the two issues were written on the ballots. It seems to be a common idea that most people who voted in favor of the anti-gay marriage measures in all three states never took the time to actually research the details of what they were voting on. All they saw was "marriage = man + woman". As though, their primary reason for voting was obama, and the marriage issues were an afterthought. Afterall, how many people really know the details of every issue on the ballot they have in front of them. If you don't know what you're voting on, you should leave it blank. My opinion anyway. That's what I did.

Regardless, the majority of the blame lies on the fundamentalists, regardless of ethnicity. Blacks in this country, as a whole, are very christian. they're going to vote with a christian mindset.

there's plenty of discrimination against homos within all minority groups. they don't see our struggles with civil rights as being the same as theirs, especially when homosexuality is still falsely regarded by most as being a choice. you can't choose what race you are. you can't choose who you're sexually attracted to either, but idiots still want to argue that. whatever.

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viscus · 11-10-2008, 06:04 AM

It's just really screwed up no matter how you slice it. On one hand you've got a minority group that had to fight long and hard for equal marriage rights only to turn around and vote to deny them to another group. On the other hand, you have a minority group that turns around and lashes out at another group for voting against their individual rights, when as you pointed out, they weren't the only group and definitely not the biggest one to do so.

It's like who needs conservative whites when the oppressed groups will just go after each other? Already I've seen comments on forums along the lines of "Cool, let's just sit back and watch the f.ags and the n.iggers kill each other."

And what does this do to gay blacks and latinos? I'm sure they must be feeling like doubly or even triply maligned members of society right now.

HumanePain · 11-10-2008, 07:15 AM

One cannot mix the voting for Obama with voting for Prop. 8, Obama wasn't voted in from a liberal perspective: he was voted in to change the old guard in the Whitehouse, to fix the economy.

The masses are still religiously conservative regardless of color, Obama's election wasn't a mandate for liberals, it was a complaint against the current administration.

So Obama's success and Prop. 8's success are unrelated.

In summary, here was the masses thinking process:

Vote for helping the economy? Sure

Vote for changing our social mores? Hell no!

As Alexander Hamilton said, "The masses are asses".

Underwater Ophelia · 11-10-2008, 08:46 AM

What percentage of California is black?
That's right! 6.2%!

Therefore, it's not their fault, unless NO ONE else voted.

Tralis · 11-10-2008, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underwater Ophelia

What percentage of California is black?
That's right! 6.2%!

Therefore, it's not their fault, unless NO ONE else voted.

It was a very close margin on Prop 8. Not saying its okay to blame any ethnic group for that, I'm just saying it was very close. It horrible that the gay community would blame the African-American community like that.

Here at UCLA living with two gay roommates, well, I have heard of nothing else for the past week. The traffic has been clogged with their protests. Its a sort of mass hysteria here. On election day I was stopped six times on my way to class, both ways, being asked to vote against Prop 8. I don't think protesting now is going to do anything, the numbers show how close it was. The better path is to fight it through legal means and try to win support not by being an angry racist mob but showing that queers are cool people too.

Underwater Ophelia · 11-10-2008, 09:39 AM

PS--only 10% of voters on prop 8 were black, so no, it wasn't their fault.

gothicusmaximus · 11-10-2008, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underwater Ophelia

PS--only 10% of voters on prop 8 were black, so no, it wasn't their fault.

... if most of them voted yes, that could still have swung the vote.

Underwater Ophelia · 11-10-2008, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gothicusmaximus

... if most of them voted yes, that could still have swung the vote.

Note your vocabulary.

JCC · 11-10-2008, 10:42 AM

They were 10% of the yes vote on Prop 8 and 6.2% of California's population?
Shit. I don't think it's right for the LGBT to counter-discriminate but I think there is a problem of homophobia within the Black Californian community that should be tackled.

gothicusmaximus · 11-10-2008, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underwater Ophelia

Note your vocabulary.

You mean the 'if'? Most black voters did support the proposition.

Underwater Ophelia · 11-10-2008, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gothicusmaximus

You mean the 'if'? Most black voters did support the proposition.

No.
They may have SWUNG the vote.
Which means it was on the fence, which means the majority of people who voted against it weren't black.

Why blame the straw when there's a whole shitload of bricks on the camel's back?

gothicusmaximus · 11-10-2008, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underwater Ophelia

No.
They may have SWUNG the vote.
Which means it was on the fence, which means the majority of people who voted against it weren't black.

Why blame the straw when there's a whole shitload of bricks on the camel's back?

Here's the problem: within other ethnic groups, the ratio of voters supporting the proposition to those opposing it either substantially favored the latter or was close to 1:1. 2 of every 3 blacks, however, voted for the law-- had this not been the case, especially given the unusually large turnout among blacks, the proposition would have been defeated.

Even if, for whatever reason, 100% of white or asian voters had voted against and the law had thereby not passed, the overwhelming support for Prop 8 among the black community would still be troubling.

Underwater Ophelia · 11-10-2008, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gothicusmaximus

Even if, for whatever reason, 100% of white or asian voters had voted against and the law had thereby not passed, the overwhelming support for Prop 8 among the black community would still be troubling.

Yes, that's true.
It isn't what we're talking about, though.

gothicusmaximus · 11-10-2008, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underwater Ophelia

Yes, that's true.
It isn't what we're talking about, though.

Yes, it is. If the black community had not manifested a disturbing level of support for proposition 8, and had voted similarly to other ethnic groups, the law wouldn't have passed.
You're asking why people are blaming black californians for the outcome-- it's because the extent of their support for the law was abnormal and discrepant. Imagine a homosexual looking at the exit polls and asking "what went wrong here?"

Asians: 57% against, 32% in favor, the rest undecided.
Latinos: 41% against, 47% in favor, the rest undecided.
Whites: 50% against, 44% in favor, the rest undecided.
Blacks: (bear in mind, this is 10% of voters): 38% opposed, 58% in favor, the rest undecided.

Necrophagist · 11-10-2008, 03:00 PM

Perhaps people should be a little more tolerant. The blacks in favor for the law should realise that tolerance goes both ways?

Lolly PopMuzik · 11-10-2008, 03:13 PM

What I find mystifying is the lack of focus on the devoutly Catholic Latino voters...

If I remember correctly, they had a large hand in the Yes vote as well.

x-deviant-x · 11-10-2008, 05:49 PM

Aside from all of this, wasn't it CA that, upon investigation, was found to not even be requiring proper ID at the polls? I may be wrong, but I know definitely there was either an area or an entire state that wasn't even asking for ID, allowing X-number of illegals to vote. This was on CNN, I just can't remember what area they said it was happening in. And no, I'm not referring to anything in regards to ACORN or the likes.

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ionic_angel · 11-10-2008, 05:56 PM

For some reason, I find this grimly hilarious.

Underwater Ophelia · 11-12-2008, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ionic_angel

For some reason, I find this grimly hilarious.

Why is it funny?

Albert Mond · 11-12-2008, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underwater Ophelia

Why is it funny?

Blacks hating gays and gays hating blacks? It's hilarious.

Maggoty Anne · 11-13-2008, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Albert Mond

Blacks hating gays and gays hating blacks? It's hilarious.

Didja watch the Colbert Report last night? Apparently Gays should start protesting black people.

ThreeEyesOni · 11-13-2008, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underwater Ophelia

Why is it funny?

It's funny in the same way that dead baby jokes are funny. It's really not, but sometimes all you have to do is laugh. Dead baby jokes are funny because most of them are so improbable (truckloads of dead babies + pitchfork = unrealistic enough to be funny). A minority that was only relatively recently allowed to vote or marry outside of the standards set by those in power? Funny.

It makes me laugh tears for the whole messed up race.