My Eulogy

[Abyssmal]

to Delicti: thanks for the links.

[Abyssmal]

Originally Posted by Renatus

We have no control whatsoever over what is posted for the banners. The gnet admin are not exactly attentive.

For Newer bands look into Darkwave

Again goth has no designated religion. Could somone please post a link on the Voltaire interview on what is goth since I can't go to youtube on a school computer. If anything the Ankh has to do with Eygptian religion not the occult. What if it were a gothic cross instead of a gothic Ankh would you then say that goth is a purely Christian subculture? You're just pointing out miniscule things in a pathetic attempt to prove your non existant point. If anything you appear to be turning into an angry little child with your posts as they are becomming less and less relavent. I would advise you to quit while you are ahead, before you start whining like a spoiled little brat saying you'll sic your older brother on us. We can keep this up all day, right now I'm posting this from a english debate class so I could use the practice.

Actually, modern Egyptian religion is considered a facet of the occult. But, enough arguing. You have finally managed to peirce the stubborness of myself. While I will keep my own beliefs of what goth truly means, I will study more about the "goth" culture portrayed on this site, so I can better communicate with most of the members on this site.

Darkwave? I have heard of that Genre, but also heard it was a mixture of dark vocals and electronica (techno). I assume that definition is incorrect?

English debate? You are in high school or college?

P.S. Actually, I am not becoming angrier with these posts. In fact, I viewed this thread as a point of entertainment and amusement. That, and I have no older siblings.

Also, is this an ad-based site? (I assume the Gnet admin post meant the person or machine that posts the ads?)

Finally, the reason: I wish to stop this argument because it has finally become a source of annoyance instead of amusement.

May the darkness envelop you,

Abyssmal

[Saddiction]

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

plus, considering on how you love commenting on my grammer and spelling, I'll give you a tip: Mainstream is not spelled maintsream.

I appreciate your tip and attempt of superior intellect, Abyssmal, however it is clearly obvious that the spelling error you decided to single out, was merely a typo. Sorry to dissapoint.

Now allow me to give you a little tip. Mainstream (in the exaple you provided) should only be spelled with a capital 'M' when being used at the beginning of a sentence. With this being said, your pathetic attempt at correcting me is ultimately null and void.

Furthermore, if you continue to make (false) observations (i.e. how I love commenting on your spelling and grammar), I would appreciate that you at least make an effort to make your observations credible by quoting the observation you are referencing.

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

As for the thesuarus discussion, first I do not read them, and I am not very good at english grammer.

Since it has been established that you are 'not very good at english grammer', you have no place to correct anyone else on this board.

For the record, it's grammar (not grammer), and thesaurus (not thesuarus).

If you would like to continue playing this little game, I'd suggest you brush up on your english spelling/grammar skills before attempting to correct other members on this forum.

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

I also notice that you only mention Slipknot, Linkin Park, and Dimmu Borgir. (All of which I will admit is mainstream.

So what's your point, exactly? That Good Charlotte, Simple Plan, Disturbed, and Iced Earth are not considered as shitty mainstream bands? Puh-leeze.

If there is one word that describes you at the moment, it would have to be 'ignorant'. Since it is apparent that you arn't exactly the sharpest knife in the drawer, I'll define it for you:

ig·no·rant [ig-ner-uhnt]
–adjective
1. uneducated in general; lacking knowledge or sophistication; "an ignorant man"; "nescient of contemporary literature"; "an unlearned group incapable of understanding complex issues"; "exhibiting contempt for his unlettered companions"
2. uneducated in the fundamentals of a given art or branch of learning; lacking knowledge of a specific field; "she is ignorant of quantum mechanics"; "he is musically illiterate"
3. unaware because of a lack of relevant information or knowledge; "he was completely ignorant of the circumstances"; "an unknowledgeable assistant"; "his rudeness was unwitting"

[LadyLucretia]

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

Finally, the reason: I wish to stop this argument because it has finally become a source of annoyance instead of amusement.

May the darkness envelop you,

Abyssmal

Goddammit, I've been trying so hard to get un-enveloped by the darkness, and now you're wishing it upon me? Do you have any idea how much that stains??!!

Seriously, though, you need to do some of your own research and cut the attitude. If you thought it would be amusing to start a flame war with a bunch of goths, then you have a pretty puerile view of what's amusing.

[Bete Noire]

[quote=Abyssmal][color=Purple]
"Darkwave? I have heard of that Genre, but also heard it was a mixture of dark vocals and electronica (techno). I assume that definition is incorrect?"

The definition is correct.

Electronica has influenced a lot of goth(ish) artists, and if you know what EBM is....

And now a question. What goth music DO you like??

Bearing in mind that if you consider metal/mainstream alt stuff gothic I am likely to feed you aforementioned llama syphiliticus...

And whilst Midnight Syndicate are vaguely gothic, they are not very much to do with the scene, as they feature very few of the musical styles typical of goth.



And whilst you are not an idiot, you do appear to be stubborn to well beyond reason.

[Abyssmal]

The darkwave/Gothic Rock bands I listen to: Grigori 3, Relenter, The ShadowPeople, and Sensuous Enemy.

[Godslayer Jillian]

I have honestly never heard of those bands. I'll have to look for them.
Darkwave is indeed a 'darker'(duh) electronic style. That's why I like to mark the difference between gothic rock and darkwave. But the thing Renatus is referring to is that many critics believe (and I also believe they're right) that darkwave bands only call themselves darkwave to avoid all the drama and conflict of the term 'goth'.
It's not something bad, it's just something like "ha! we figured out your little maneuver"

[LadyLucretia]

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

The darkwave/Gothic Rock bands I listen to: Grigori 3, Relenter, The ShadowPeople, and Sensuous Enemy.

I have never heard any of these bands so I figured I give you the benefit of the doubt, and look them up and give them all a listen. Here is my assessment:

The guitars in Grigori 3 are way too heavy for it to be called darkwave or gothic rock.

Relenter sounds more like straight-up electro rock; goth friendly sure (they're very Depeche Mode influenced), but not necessarily goth.

The ShadowPeople actually seems to fit the bill - the music is very Shadow Project inspired, and all of the band members list one or more goth bands as influences.

Sensuous enemy are clearly electronica leaning towards techno. There is nothing particularly dark, and definitely nothing "rock" about them.

Listen, there isn't anything wrong with not knowing much about goth music. We were all there at one point or another. But each time you claim to be more knowledgeable than you actually are, it discredits you even further.

[Renatus]

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

You have finally managed to peirce the stubborness of myself.

Yay progress! Maybe there is hope for you, but you poked a few too many bears so be prepared for a bit of a harsh time at first. I look forward to seeing a non confrontational egar to learn version of you.

[Wormboy]

Originally Posted by Saddiction

I think you have 'goth' confused with 'spooky kid'.

Technically a Spooky Kid is a Marilyn Manson fan. You know, like the Kiss Army.

Originally Posted by Renatus

For a more historicly specific answer: The whole name issue sort of is like a abnormal game of telephone. The first goths the germanic goth (just plain goth) tribes of Europe were the ones who sacked rome. The Ostrogoths and the Vistigoths split off back in the 3rd century. In the general area to where they expanded to (which covered at least half of Europe) came about gothic architecture in the 12th century. Then as we approach our modern era we come across gothic fiction which is essentialy a cross of horror and romance this is essentialy the most basic element of what modern goth is. Goth fiction eventualy dies out in the early 20th century only to come back half a century later when it is revived by a movment defined by it's sound that evolved from punk better known as gothic rock. Now into the 21st century we see a new genre known as Darkwave the only genre other than gothic rock that is recognized by the Goth community as goth (though controversy exists as to if it is just called darkwave to avoid being called gothic rock). This was my version of the smallest possible way to explain how goth came to be, thank you.

....I love you, sex me

Originally Posted by Saddiction

You have proved nothing other than the fact that you are a walking stereotype.

'oooh look at me, I'm so dark and macabre. I like to listen to shitty mainstream metal while serving up dead babiesto the darkest of occultist deities. I'm... so... effing... gawth!!' ...... \m/ *0* \m/

Dude, wearing raver pants with combat boots accented by shitty band shirts, doesn't make you 'goth'. Neither does dabbling in the 'occult', or listening to shitty maintsream bands like Slipknot, Linkin Park, or Dimmu Borgir.

PS. are you one of the idiots wearing lipstick in this photo?
http://cmsimg.floridatoday.com/apps/...xH=650&title=0
If so, don't fret. You'll grow out of this terribly misunderstood phase. I almost guarantee it.

But they look like such a fun bunch of people!

[Underwater Ophelia]

I didn't actually think he was too bad. He just ended up having to stick his foot in his mouth.

[LadyStardust]

I am, admittedly, horribly ignorant regarding goth culture/music (though I'm trying my best to learn). Therefor, I have happily devoured all the information that has been poured down this boy's throat. This latest turn, however, definitely inspired me to do some poking around, and to speak up.

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

Actually, modern Egyptian religion is considered a facet of the occult.

So, do you consider 'occult' to simply include alternative religions? If so, I believe the term you're looking for is 'Paganism.' I've been studying Wicca for a few years now, myself (though I've been guilty of not practising it nearly enough). And not that "New Wiccan Church" crap, either. You know, the oldest religion known to mankind?

I looked up "occult" in the Merriam Webster dictionary, just to double check that I was staying true to the actual definition rather than a popular one, and found that it was defined (rather vaguely) as such: "matters regarded as involving the action or influence of supernatural or supernormal powers or some secret knowledge of them."

If you accept this definition, than even the most devout Roman Catholics believe in the occult. Miracles performed by Jesus, his resurrection, miracles performed by saints . . . these are all occult happenings. I, at least, would consider them to be "supernatural or supernormal." So yes, ALL religions have aspects of the occult, save for those who have no belief in supernatural happenings at all.

This said, saying you practice the occult is more vague than Madame Jo Jo's astrological predictions. What on Earth, I wonder, are you talking about?

[Metabolik]

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

So, what bands do you listen to?

the heaviest shit I can find, and a small amount of SlipKnoT...and mostly DevilDriver...and Behemoth.

[Bete Noire]

Originally Posted by Metabolik

the heaviest SHIT I can find, and a small amount of SlipKnoT...and mostly DevilDriver...and Behemoth.

SHIT it is:P

[HellforgedX]

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

...something a little child should say in the most base of arguments.

And by what standards does this arguement measure high enough to NOT be base? If, in fact, it is even an arguement! I feel like throwing sodie-pop.

[Stuporman]

Originally Posted by HellforgedX

And by what standards does this arguement measure high enough to NOT be base? If, in fact, it is even an arguement! I feel like throwing sodie-pop.

"To not be base"? Way to split infinitives, you base, base creature.

[Uncle Smoov]

Well if it isn't just the dweeb parade over here. Dr. Douche Bag, equally accurately known as Abyssmal, gets the party started by assing off all over the place, and then Goering Grammar infects everybody's heads with "the way you type things makes me want to heave the juices from my gut." But as though that weren't enough for my regal eyes to behold, I have to suffer through "UR MISIK NO MIE MIZIK" as though you're racist against music that has more in relation to bullshit than beauty.

[HellforgedX]

Originally Posted by Stuporman

"To not be base"? Way to split infinitives, you base, base creature.

Damn skippy! "NOT" can be used to split ALL infinitives, as in "To be, or to NOT be, what was the question?"
And a base creature I am lest a base creature I become.
::Jackie Chan's Uncle's voice:: ONE MORE THING! Why everybody take me seriously?

[Abyssmal]

Originally Posted by LadyStardust

I am, admittedly, horribly ignorant regarding goth culture/music (though I'm trying my best to learn). Therefor, I have happily devoured all the information that has been poured down this boy's throat. This latest turn, however, definitely inspired me to do some poking around, and to speak up.




So, do you consider 'occult' to simply include alternative religions? If so, I believe the term you're looking for is 'Paganism.' I've been studying Wicca for a few years now, myself (though I've been guilty of not practising it nearly enough). And not that "New Wiccan Church" crap, either. You know, the oldest religion known to mankind?

I looked up "occult" in the Merriam Webster dictionary, just to double check that I was staying true to the actual definition rather than a popular one, and found that it was defined (rather vaguely) as such: "matters regarded as involving the action or influence of supernatural or supernormal powers or some secret knowledge of them."

If you accept this definition, than even the most devout Roman Catholics believe in the occult. Miracles performed by Jesus, his resurrection, miracles performed by saints . . . these are all occult happenings. I, at least, would consider them to be "supernatural or supernormal." So yes, ALL religions have aspects of the occult, save for those who have no belief in supernatural happenings at all.

This said, saying you practice the occult is more vague than Madame Jo Jo's astrological predictions. What on Earth, I wonder, are you talking about?

I was actually talking about paganism. I practice a mixture of various pagan beliefs including Asatru, Druidism, Thelema, Wicca, and Ars Falcis.

Originally Posted by LadyLucretia

I have never heard any of these bands so I figured I give you the benefit of the doubt, and look them up and give them all a listen. Here is my assessment:

The guitars in Grigori 3 are way too heavy for it to be called darkwave or gothic rock.

Relenter sounds more like straight-up electro rock; goth friendly sure (they're very Depeche Mode influenced), but not necessarily goth.

The ShadowPeople actually seems to fit the bill - the music is very Shadow Project inspired, and all of the band members list one or more goth bands as influences.

Sensuous enemy are clearly electronica leaning towards techno. There is nothing particularly dark, and definitely nothing "rock" about them.

Listen, there isn't anything wrong with not knowing much about goth music. We were all there at one point or another. But each time you claim to be more knowledgeable than you actually are, it discredits you even further.

I wasn’t trying to seem more knowledgeable about darkwave, I was simply stating the bands that I liked out of the list of bands that I listened to when I typed “Darkwave Music” into the Eliteweb.cc search engine.

[delicti]

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

I wasn’t trying to seem more knowledgeable about darkwave, I was simply stating the bands that I liked out of the list of bands that I listened to when I typed “Darkwave Music” into the Eliteweb.cc search engine.

Ouch. Please don't do that again.

Here, buy these:

http://www.amazon.com/Dark-Pleasures...0647229&sr=8-5
http://www.amazon.com/Gothic-Rock-Vo...0647229&sr=8-6
http://www.amazon.com/Gothic-Rock-Vo...0647229&sr=8-1
http://www.amazon.com/Slight-Case-Ov...0647334&sr=8-1

That is a much better intro to goth than you'll find through a search engine.

[Abyssmal]

I have found another band I like, though I have listened to them before, a friend just told me they were darkwave/gothic rock. Cruxshadows. Correct me if my friend was wrong.

[Bete Noire]

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

I have found another band I like, though I have listened to them before, a friend just told me they were darkwave/gothic rock. Cruxshadows. Correct me if my friend was wrong.

Your friend's right.

[delicti]

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

I have found another band I like, though I have listened to them before, a friend just told me they were darkwave/gothic rock. Cruxshadows. Correct me if my friend was wrong.

I'm probably going to get some flak for this, but they used to be very darkwave-y, now they're just plain techno/house.

If you're going to listen to them for sheer goth appeal, there's no need to get anything other than "Telemetry of a Fallen Angel".

[Bete Noire]

Originally Posted by delicti

I'm probably going to get some flak for this, but they used to be very darkwave-y, now they're just plain techno/house.

If you're going to listen to them for sheer goth appeal, there's no need to get anything other than "Telemetry of a Fallen Angel".

True. But at least it's better than Simple Plan:P

[LadyLucretia]

Originally Posted by Abyssmal

I wasn’t trying to seem more knowledgeable about darkwave, I was simply stating the bands that I liked out of the list of bands that I listened to when I typed “Darkwave Music” into the Eliteweb.cc search engine.

So you believe everything you read on the internet then?

A tip: most music websites mislabel stuff. Learn the actual musical styles by listening to them, not reading about them.