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| Politics "Under democracy, one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove that the other party is unfit to rule -and both commonly succeed, and are right."
-H.L. Menken |
11-07-2008, 09:24 PM
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#26
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Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: El Paso, Texas/ Ciudad Juarez, Chihuahua
Posts: 9,203
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So... Obama was elected because America's racist?
__________________
"No theory, no ready-made system, no book that has ever been written will save the world.
I cleave to no system. I am a true seeker."
-Mikhail Bakunin
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Originally Posted by George Carlin
People who say they don’t care what people think are usually desperate to have people think they don’t care what people think.
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11-07-2008, 09:24 PM
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#27
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Raxacoricofallapatorius
Posts: 1,750
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Originally Posted by Underwater Ophelia
I didn't contest that.
I said that you can have a good understanding of something without experiencing it.
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True, but not this. The way people interact within a society is hard to grasp without being immersed in it. You can get a rough idea, but it's a whole other ball game when you're neck deep in it.
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Because before too long there'll be nothing left alive, not a creature on the land or sea, a bird in the sky. They'll be shot, harpooned, eaten, and hunted too much, vivisected by the clever men who prove that there's no such things as a fair world with live and let live. The Royal family go hunting, what an example to give to the people they lead and that don't include me, I've seen enough pain and torture of those who can't speak...
- Tough Shit, Mickey by Conflict
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11-07-2008, 09:25 PM
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#28
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Raxacoricofallapatorius
Posts: 1,750
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Godslayer Jillian
So... Obama was elected because America's racist?
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No, he was elected because he's good at talking.
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Because before too long there'll be nothing left alive, not a creature on the land or sea, a bird in the sky. They'll be shot, harpooned, eaten, and hunted too much, vivisected by the clever men who prove that there's no such things as a fair world with live and let live. The Royal family go hunting, what an example to give to the people they lead and that don't include me, I've seen enough pain and torture of those who can't speak...
- Tough Shit, Mickey by Conflict
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11-07-2008, 09:40 PM
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#29
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 690
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I simply have to refer you all back to the original point of this thread which NONE of you have bothered to address, instead taking it upon yourselves to discuss something completely different:
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Originally Posted by Sir. Helpmann
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Originally Posted by Lolly PopMuzik
As the one of few black folks on here, I say there's more history to make with this and quite a bit of potential.
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I don't quite see what point "black folks" are trying to say. Are they trying to suggest that, as "black folks" they are more qualified to have an opinion politically regarding Barack Obama because he is "black"?
(mixed race)
It's such nonsense. What if the President elected had a big chin?
Would everyone who had a big chin be more qualified to have an opinon politically regarding President Chin?
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Seriously...
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11-08-2008, 12:59 AM
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#30
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Michigan, U.S.A.
Posts: 244
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sir. Helpmann
I simply have to refer you all back to the original point of this thread which NONE of you have bothered to address, instead taking it upon yourselves to discuss something completely different:
Seriously...
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That's how all the threads are in this forum.
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11-08-2008, 01:08 AM
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#31
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Namibia
Posts: 2,526
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by ~~Auriel~~
That's how all the threads are in this forum.
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If we didn't address it, it was because no matter how much explanation one does, Helpmann will never understand anything he knows nothing about.
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11-08-2008, 02:13 AM
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#32
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: Your mother.
Posts: 1,044
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Not this ' racism goes both ways ' crap. Stop playing the victim card, and get the fuck over it.
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11-08-2008, 02:51 AM
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#33
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Nowhere
Posts: 1,835
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Originally Posted by Albert Mond
HOW TO PRETEND TO BE WINNING ARGUMENTS HELPMANN STYLE:
Step 1: Use a single irrelevant event as your reference for your hypothesis about a seperate event.
Step 2: When you fail to make a convincing argument due to your lack of reading comprehension, or your opponent points out your lack of credibility, distract them with one of these "Arguments" posts.
GOOD LUCK, DUMBASS!
Yes. Yes you can. |
Don't forget the whole "pointing out a fallacious debating style and attributing it to your opponent while hoping that no one will notice that you're using those very same fallacies yourself" issue.
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11-08-2008, 02:53 AM
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#34
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Namibia
Posts: 2,526
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Beneath the Shadows
Don't forget the whole "pointing out a fallacious debating style and attributing it to your opponent while hoping that no one will notice that you're using those very same fallacies yourself" issue.
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I think I covered that, too.
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11-08-2008, 03:14 AM
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#35
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,678
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Godslayer Jillian
So... Obama was elected because America's racist?
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Essentially, yes. America is racist so there's either two eventualities from voters of Obama:
1) They wanted to try and veil their racism.
2) They voted him in to try and combat racism.
You're forgetting here that the voters were the electoral college, NOT the people.
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11-08-2008, 03:21 AM
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#36
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Namibia
Posts: 2,526
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by JCC
Essentially, yes. America is racist so there's either two eventualities from voters of Obama:
1) They wanted to try and veil their racism.
2) They voted him in to try and combat racism.
You're forgetting here that the voters were the electoral college, NOT the people.
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He still got popular vote, so it doesn't matter much. Not that I don't think the electoral college is crap.
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11-08-2008, 03:25 AM
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#37
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,678
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He got the popular vote by 6%, he got the electoral vote by nearer 75%.
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11-08-2008, 03:32 AM
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#38
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Namibia
Posts: 2,526
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by JCC
He got the popular vote by 6%, he got the electoral vote by nearer 75%.
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Exactly. Either way he wins. And I think we can still agree that either way, the Electoral College sucks.
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11-08-2008, 05:40 AM
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#39
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,721
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Joker_in_the_Pack
True, but not this. The way people interact within a society is hard to grasp without being immersed in it. You can get a rough idea, but it's a whole other ball game when you're neck deep in it.
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I wouldn't be too quick to place either one over the other. First-hand experience gives you only a very narrow insight - without at least a basic understanding the background, that ain't worth shit. That's like saying that walking through the ghetto will give someone more of a handle on the issue of racism than learning about the history of slavery and its enduring impact on present-day institutional racism.
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All pleasure is relief from tension. - William S. Burroughs
Witches have no wit, said the magician who was weak.
Hula, hula, said the witches. - Norman Mailer
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11-08-2008, 09:02 AM
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#40
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 690
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by JCC
Essentially, yes. America is racist so there's either two eventualities from voters of Obama:
1) They wanted to try and veil their racism.
2) They voted him in to try and combat racism.
You're forgetting here that the voters were the electoral college, NOT the people.
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I agree; but I don't think they voted him in to combat racism.
Racism will always exist in the same way that murder and theft exists.
I think people voted for Obama essentially out of responsibility. Mccain simply was too old, too outdated and lacking in political judgement; the fact that this tired and withering old fool picked Sarah Palin as his Vice President is a testimony to the desperation of an octogenarian has-been.
Obama has style, media glitz... the makings of a modern political leader in an age where image counts and money talks.
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11-08-2008, 10:53 AM
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#41
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,678
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Oh, I know that it probably wasn't the case that they wanted to combat racism, racism's good for business. Just pointing out the possibility.
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11-10-2008, 08:54 AM
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#42
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: R'lyeh
Posts: 2,104
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Race is an issue everywhere.
It shouldn't be but it is.
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11-10-2008, 09:05 AM
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#43
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Osaka, Japan
Posts: 1,472
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sir. Helpmann
Only with regards to wealth and public property.
Which is why Obama could never possibly implament a National Health service in the same way a European country can.
Nor does he intend to.
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It will happen state-by-state first. There's a movement towards single-payer universal healthcare in California that's got quite a bit of momentum behind it.
__________________
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"Now some of you may encounter the devil's bargain if you get that far. Any old soul is worth saving at least to a priest, but not every soul is worth buying. So you can take the offer as a compliment."
-William S. Burroughs
You're not entitled to your opinion.
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