THIS articl as posted by a friend of mine...

[LaKeesha]

This friend f mine - Ms. Gina - posted this in a blog. I figured that perhaps this article is an indirect result of workers' rights slowly going to shit in the U.S.


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Sunday, February 11, 2007


Just a blog before I go....
Current mood: predatory

...to work, which I REALLY don't feel like being at today. So don't I just shut it and call in sick? 1) I was raised to be a fucking masochist, and 2) It's too late in the day for that. However, the following column, scribed by one of the FEW people I have respect for in this God-forsaken hellhole called PA, managed to chirk me up a bit. Mike Argento is one of the best things about the York Daily Record/Dispatch, whatever the fuck it is. Here's the deal: our local Harley plant workers have gone on strike, and for damn good reason--they rich, overbloated thugs they work for who call themselves "management" wanted the workers to start paying into their insurance. If this sounds like a bunch of disgruntled, overly-paid workers having a hissy-fit....read on. And I don't EVER want to hear the intonation, "Greed is GOOD". Fuck that shit. Read on:


Argento's column: Good workers deserve respect
..subtitle-->..byline-->
By MIKE ARGENTO
Daily Record/Sunday News
..date-->
Article Launched: 02/09/2007 06:09:01 PM EST

.. Feb 9, 2007 — Some years ago, a Harley boss - I can't remember which one - was talking about the people who build the best motorcycles in the world when he asked, "How many people where you work have York Daily Record tattoos?"

How'd he know?

He was talking about the loyalty and dedication and pride and commitment of the people who worked at Harley. Affixing your employer's name permanently to your body is an indication of a level of loyalty that few of us can comprehend. I mean, Harley-Davidson is forever. Your first ex-wife, well, not so much.

That Harley boss was clearly proud of his people, and his people were proud of him. They seemed to get along very well. They knew each other's families and when they asked about them, it wasn't just to be polite. The motorcycle maker, at that time, was doing well, and the company was doing right by its people.

Boy, how things have changed.

It's not just Harley, either. It used to be employers believed their workers were their greatest asset. Now, they're seen as a burden. They're told to take whatever deal the company throws out there, and if they don't, the company threatens to move to some third-world joint such as Indonesia or Mexico or South Carolina. It's like that

everywhere.

Harley hasn't made that threat, but you have to wonder whether, one day, we'll see Harleys Hecho en Mexico. As it is, they make Fender Telecasters in Mexico, and you can't buy an American-made pair of Levis anymore.

As you've probably heard, Harley's out on strike, and to give you an indication of how bad things are, the vote by members of Local 175 of the International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers was 98 percent in favor of walking.

Ninety-eight percent. Name something, anything, where you can get 98 percent of any group of people in any room to agree on anything.

That's pretty stunning.

And you can't blame these folks for striking.

Yes, they are paid well and have good benefits. I've heard the callers to talk radio and have read the e-mails from readers who bemoan the wages earned by Harley workers. They all say if they don't like it, they can go work someplace else. Nice.

These people remind me of an old Cold-war-era joke. An Italian, a Frenchman, an Englishman and a Russian are asked to describe their most desirable dreams.

The Italian said, "I want my country to produce the greatest artists."

The Frenchman said, "I want my nation to produce the greatest philosophers."

The Englishman said, "I want my country to produce the greatest parliamentarians."

The Russian said, "I want my neighbor's cow to die."

OK, I didn't say it was a great joke. But it does illustrate the point. A lot of people want Harley workers' cows to die.

It's not just jealousy. The people who criticize Harley workers are just plain wrong.

For one thing, yes, Harley workers are paid well. But they work hard and produce a product of unquestioned quality.

It wasn't always that way. More than 25 years ago, or so, Harley was owned by AMF, and they almost destroyed the company. In the '70s, Harley-Davidsons were bad. Quality had slipped. The company was making all kinds of stupid decisions. (Remember when they used to make those little dirt bikes to compete with the Japanese? They looked ridiculous.)

The company came back in the '80s, after senior management bought the company. They forged a relationship with the union and the workers to bring Harley back to prominence, and they did it. As partners.

Now, it seems Harley wants to show the union who's boss.

Look at the facts. A company that made more than $1 billion in profits last year is asking for concessions and looking to cut wages of new hires. The CEO of Harley, James Ziemer, made $9.8 million in 2005, according to Forbes magazine. Ziemer took over as CEO only in the middle of that year.

OK, let's do some math. The average Harley worker makes $43,000 or so. The CEO raked in $9.8 million during his first six months at the helm. Much of that compensation was in stock, Forbes reported. In October last year, Ziemer cashed in stock worth nearly $9.7 million.

I'm not very good at math, but it looks to me like the CEO of Harley makes more than 200 times what the average factory worker makes.

And his stock is continuing to increase in value, going from $47 a share to nearly $76 a share, at its peak, in the past year.

And why is his stock value increasing?

Because the people who make those motorcycles do a good job. They work hard, and they're very good at what they do. You can't just get a bunch of trained chimps to make a product the quality of a Harley.

Ziemer said as much. Announcing the company's wonderful fiscal situation at the end of 2006, he was quoted as saying, "After more than two decades of uninterrupted growth at Harley-Davidson, our dedicated employees and passionate dealers have once again delivered excellent results. I couldn't ask for a more committed workforce and dealer network."

He seemed to like his workers then, when they were making him tons of money.

So Harley is doing well. It is doing very well. And they're asking their workers to take cuts.

And then, on Wednesday, Harley cancelled union member's health care benefits.

Unbelievable.

The people who built this company, who do the work, who produce the product that makes Harley an international icon, deserve to be treated with respect. Instead, they get this.

Now, as a matter of full disclosure, I should say, first, that I am a union member. And secondly, I know people who work at Harley. And thirdly, my wife's step-father, Ron, is retired from Harley.

If the people who work at Harley are anything like Ron, they don't get paid enough. Ron went to work at Harley when he came home from Vietnam and worked there for 40 years. He's the hardest-working man I've ever met. Last summer, he helped me build a deck and almost put me in the ground.

He worked at Harley during bad times and during good times.

Right now, it looks like bad times.

At least for the folks who have Harley tats.

Argento, you're a freakin' GOD

[Tha Duckman]

The economy is going to shit any way. Who's geared up for being part of the new China?

[ArtificialOne]

First off the economies good. That's why the dems and the media aren't spurting about it becuase it would make the reps look good (not taking sides). Home sales are leveling off and inflation is down.

Second,
I used to live in that hell hole of York, pa and went to school there. I found the people to be the most rude and obnoxious people I have yet to come across in my worldwide travels. (not to mention one of the most ugly areas of the world... very depressing)

The union ran Catapillar out of the city and now the union is working on Harley. I have yet to work for a us company that pays the whole medical insurance. I usually have to contribute about thirty or so dollars a check to it.

Fat cats in management?
My friends dad worked on the frame line and got payed 18 an hour to pull and stack frames...18 for that? For lifting a 50lb (22.5K) frame a foot onto a cart?

Once again the Union wants to dictate to companies what they can and can't do. That's why york lost cat.

I happen to like working for large companies. I get better pay and less hassle. Not to mention better benifits and being treated like a human being. I've worked for several..ok maybe about a dozen small businesses and have mostly been treated like road grime at all of them.

I can see another company moving out of the *sshole of the US called york, pa.

I very much liked australia's labor laws and such. But the factis different cultures have different ideas of workplace conditions. You can't compare the US to other countries. We have a large and complex set of laws for labor and many many different kinds of businesses. You have to shop around and find a good place to work for. It won't just jump out and bite you. Nor can you judge an entire countries workplace conditions on one company.

[ArtificialOne]

Also, the Union was striking about harley when I first moved there.
Unions would rather bully companies into complying with their demands than try to strike a reasonable agreement. That's why most companies run whenever they hear the word "Union".

Here in Visalia, CA and the surrounding south calley the carpenters union has been bullying local hotels and housing developements to hire union workers. Many of these companies are small and can't afford to pay someone the 22.00 an hour that the union is asking. The union is hiring non-union people to hold up signs outside of developements and hotels to force them to use the union?

Bullies, that's how I see them. I've never been in a town where the union brought a company in or added to the local economy.

I myself have been bullied by union members to join so I can work where they do.

I beleive that at one time the unions did great good. But, now with OSHA and other labor depts I think they are obosolete.

And sometimes the unions ask for outrageous dues, such as 500 bucks or more a year....

I know I'm all upset about this topic, but I've just seen so much harm come from unions over the last several years in areas I've lived in.

Arhg!!!!!!!!!!!

Anyways off to the bookstore to buy a new mag....maybe about science or... ROBOTS!!!!
lol

[CptSternn]

Originally Posted by ArtificialOne

First off the economies good. That's why the dems and the media aren't spurting about it becuase it would make the reps look good (not taking sides). Home sales are leveling off and inflation is down.

Really? First, we must assume you are talking about the economy. Second, are you talking about the american econmy? With jobless rates at a new high

http://news.**********/s/ap/20070215..._fi/economy_18

And the housing market hitting a bubble bursting record new low

http://money.cnn.com/2007/02/15/real...ies&eref=yahoo

And the fact since gw took over the dollar has devalued more than it ever has in the past. I mean, yeah, the us stock market is at new highs, but the american dollar is shite.

Before bush took office one american dollar bought 1.8 euro. Now, it gets you .80, about eighty cent. Thats because with the amount of borrowing bush has done to fund the war american money is worth alot less, meaning american products, and everything else are also worht less.

http://agonist.org/euro_officially_surpasses_dollar

This means the us has to borrow more to fund less, and with the time to have to pay for all this soon approaching, it means america is looking at another depression.

[ArtificialOne]

Strern, You don't even live here. You quote articles without any firsthand knowledge.

The dollar goes up and down all the time. It's traded just like any other commodity.

The deficit and such is measured in percantage of gdp, not dollars really. If you put it in dollars it sounds huge.

Also as bad as bush might be. He cut the deficit more than the estimate of his plan for the year.

And doesn't europe and ireland have huge unemployment? Several countries might have utopian like working conditions but doesn't most of the old soviet block and some countries east of there have near slave like conditions?

I'll take the US and maybe aus over any of those countries..

Isn't that the point you're trying to make? That the US is bad and it's economy is bad and europe is better with it's two good examples of good places to work and many horrible slave labor conditions in the others?

[CptSternn]

Originally Posted by ArtificialOne

Strern, You don't even live here. You quote articles without any firsthand knowledge.

Once again, I didn't write any of those article.s Are you arguing the issues with the experts or saying the newspapers are reporting it wrong?

The dollar goes up and down all the time. It's traded just like any other commodity.

Very true. What also is true is since bush took office it has been in the proverbial crapper - losing over half its value and it still has yet to get it back. With debt piling up, it won't be 'strong' again until that deficit is wiped - meaning by bushs own (flawed) math 2012 at the EARLIEST, thats if the war ends the day he leaves office (his projected budget has no money alloted for ANY wars after 2008) and somehow social security fixes itself magically.

The deficit and such is measured in percantage of gdp, not dollars really. If you put it in dollars it sounds huge.

It doesn't sound huge, it IS huge. It as stated in the article is the largest it has ever been in history. Never before has the dollar been so low and the defict carried by america been so high. Thats a fact.

Also as bad as bush might be. He cut the deficit more than the estimate of his plan for the year.

He cut his 'projected' defict by a few billion, meaning there still will be a huge defict larger than ever before. Also note its 'projected' and his last budget was a few HUNDRED billion OFF for the past few years. By off I mean much like he stated the total cost of the Iraq war would be under 100 billion, and its now cost more than five times that his past budgets have all been off by a few hundred billion.

The one thing that makes me smile is knowing not one cent of my money has ever gone to fund the war.

And doesn't europe and ireland have huge unemployment? Several countries might have utopian like working conditions but doesn't most of the old soviet block and some countries east of there have near slave like conditions?

Not really. Poland, Lithuania, Slovakia, and the others are all doing pretty well. Yes, they are pulling out of a post soviet era and are not doing as well as some other nations but thanks to the EU they are getting beneifts which are allowing them to grow exponentially each year rasing their standards of living like never before.

I'll take the US and maybe aus over any of those countries..

Isn't that the point you're trying to make? That the US is bad and it's economy is bad and europe is better with it's two good examples of good places to work and many horrible slave labor conditions in the others?

No, I'm pointing out the errors in your logic. You claim the us is doing well and the economy is good. Never before in the history of america has the economy been so bad. Right now, 100% of everything you see is artificially preserved through defict spending. The bush administration has kept the american people from feeling the true impact of the war by borrowing, borrowing, borrowing. Right now, thats starting to slow since other nations are getting to their limits. Also the airline bailouts, auto industry bailouts, train bailouts, and all those other bailouts bush put into effect when he first took office are running dry, meaning its just a matter of time before companies start laying off workers in droves and the economy takes a steep plunge.

[nuksaa]

Second, are you talking about the american econmy? With jobless rates at a new high

Unemployment for January 2007 is 4.6%. That is +0.1% from December 2006 and -0.1% from January 2006.

Not sure how this new high is achieved as the link didn't work. (I forgot what to substitute the ********** in order to make the link work. Sternn, since you link many articles from this same source, could you include the reminder in your signature?) With the current rate being 4.6% for January 2007, I am not sure where this new high is being compared. If you are comparing the previous administration to past administrations, the GWB era currently has a 4.73% average and the Clinton era had a 5.2% average. The highest unemployment rate in the past few decade was back in November/December 1982 at 10.8%.

If we compare Ireland and the EU, Ireland has reported a 4.5% rate as of January 2007 with the EU at 7.5%. The 4.5% is an increase of 0.1% from December 2006 and an increase of +0.2% from January 2006.

[ArtificialOne]

So why did you post the articles stern?

You always like to point out info and then claim "Don't blame me" status. What a bunch of BS. Don't post stuff you don't back.

Estonia under the great EU is one of the countries in the world with the largest sex slave trade.

As far as bailouts? What the clinton admin never did? Local govts never do? Don't forget that clinton gave the auto industry millions to devolope hybrid cars and did nothing?

And once again you try to bring the iraq war into everything. I don't care what your views on the war are since you don't pay US taxes (since you brought it up).

I mean isn't that your whole point? I mean why are you posting here anyway. We are talking about US conditions in the workplace. You are trying to bring iraq and your own highly inflated opinion that europe is the center of the universe and is better than anywhere else.

OoOoOoh so you didn't pay anything into the war, good for you. Want a cookie?

Lets get back to the topic.

Workplace conditons are not that bad in the US. Everyone has to start on the bottom and work their way up. The great thing about the US is you can move jobs if you don't like the one you're in. Some countries you can't change jobs because there aren't any better ones to go to. The whole point of the US style of govt and attitude is to make it on your own. And have the freedom to choose. The US has a good economy and many employers. We are not strapped into a particular job unless you yourself have trapped you into one.

Go away stern and let the rest of us have comments and opinions not so obviously biased by your hatred of americans and everything we are.

You obviously had a bad go of things here and now feel a need to bash anything and anyone from the states.

[CptSternn]

Originally Posted by nuksaa

Unemployment for January 2007 is 4.6%. That is +0.1% from December 2006 and -0.1% from January 2006.

Not sure how this new high is achieved as the link didn't work. (I forgot what to substitute the ********** in order to make the link work.

YAHOO DOT COM (The full address is news dot yahoo dot com)

[CptSternn]

Originally Posted by ArtificialOne

So why did you post the articles stern?

You always like to point out info and then claim "Don't blame me" status. What a bunch of BS. Don't post stuff you don't back.

I posted them for discussion. Your previous post said and I quote 'those are wrong'. Well, what exactly do you disagree with? Are you saying the writers are wrong? The government statistics are wrong? You blast me for posting articles like I wrote, published, and distributed them.

As far as bailouts? What the clinton admin never did? Local govts never do? Don't forget that clinton gave the auto industry millions to devolope hybrid cars and did nothing?

There have been numerous bailouts. Thats not the issue. Problem is, there has been no fix, therefore another bailout is going to be needed at a time when there is no money to go around. Do the math.

And once again you try to bring the iraq war into everything. I don't care what your views on the war are since you don't pay US taxes (since you brought it up).

Well that is the elephant in the room in any polticial discussion these days. And do try the 'its not your problem' as some type of cop out - the country I do live in and pay taxes has housed HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS of refugees from Iraq, where as america has only housed about 400 so far. My taxes go for that. Furthermore, my taxes pay over €10,000 a day in security at Shannon Airport to 'protect' the troops there. You may have noticed those banners on my camp post.

The whole point of the US style of govt and attitude is to make it on your own. And have the freedom to choose. The US has a good economy and many employers. We are not strapped into a particular job unless you yourself have trapped you into one.

Really? So if the average joe decides to switch jobs now, he can ask the government to support his family and pay all of his bills plus give him money for college during the transition? I didn't know you could do that in america. You can here and in Australia.

Go away stern and let the rest of us have comments and opinions not so obviously biased by your hatred of americans and everything we are.

First off, I was here years before you, and much like the other right wing nuts will be here years after you.

I think its funny your assumtpion I hate americans. I have a dislike for the american government, but much like in the discussion of Jesus Camp, one will find that people jump to conclusions and act like eejits when they are told to do so by their leaders.

I don't like bush or his policies. I don't like the fact americans get the short end of the stick in social issues and education. Pointing out this and opening a discussion on how to remedy that automatically means I'm anti-america?

Thats why things don't get better there. People, like yourself, personalise and internalise the issues when you, yourself should be standing up and questioning those very policies and reports I post here - not jumping on the defensive and trying to wave the flag. Thats not bringing back jobs to your country nor is it helping in Iraq.

[CptSternn]

To further my point...

Foreclosures rising among high-risk US mortgages

http://news.**********/s/csm/2007030...ien5pLGPLMWM0F

NEW YORK - One of the great legacies of the housing boom of the past six years is that almost everyone – even people with questionable credit – has access to a mortgage.

Across the nation, foreclosures and defaults are rising as mortgages that were once affordable are now expensive albatrosses as the introductory "teaser rates" that made the loan possible end and higher interest rates kick in. Some housing specialists worry that the mortgage industry – with more than 20 companies already in bankruptcy – will raise its lending standards so high that would-be homeowners with less-than-perfect credit will be frozen out. There is even some concern that the pullback in lending will extend the slump in the nation's housing market.

"It's the most serious threat to the economy," says Mark Zandi of Moody's Economy.com. "It has the potential to set the housing market back another big notch since there could be a whole class of people who can't get credit."

At issue is a class of mortgages that lenders call "subprime" because they do not qualify for the lowest or prime interest rate. These are designed for high-risk borrowers, those with fixed incomes, or those who have had credit problems in the past. Since 1998, more than 6 million Americans have borrowed in this way, according to the Center for Responsible Lending (CRL). The majority of these loans are adjustable-rate mortgages (ARM) that are tied to changes in interest rates.

One in five loans subprime
That's a dramatic increase in only a decade. In 1995, subprime mortgages represented a niche market: less than 5 percent of mortgages originated. Today, Wall Street analysts estimate they make up from 18 percent to 24 percent.

Advocates contend they've made it possible for millions of Americans who in the past would not be able to qualify for a mortgage to own their home. But critics contend they've also become open to abuse, in part because qualification standards are now so low....


Accompanied by...

Stocks post worst week in over 4 years

http://news.**********/s/ap/wall_str...KppTkYiHzMWM0F

NEW YORK - Stocks stumbled in the final session of a tumultuous week Friday as the yen rallied against the dollar and concerns about the U.S. economy still dogged investors after Tuesday's huge drop. The Dow Jones industrials logged their worst weekly performance in more than four years.

Signs of the declining economy. Without a war machine to drive the defense industry, and corporations no longer able to over charge tax payers for fake services in Iraq, profits which were artificially inflated since bush took office will drop.

[LaKeesha]

I reside in Florida. I am originally from Chicago. I have lived in Boston AND Atlanta. I will tell you that pay and working conditions seem to be better in the northern states than the southern states.