Gothic Discrimination in School

Sakred_Winter · 09-01-2005, 08:42 AM

Recently, I began the schoolyear at Bloomfield Jr/Sr High School. And one of the things that caught my eyes under the student dress-code is that any dress that is 'distracting' is banned including, but not limited to mind you the 'gothic' style of dress.

First of all, the generalization 'distracting' is to general to be lawful. Second of all, that was a direct attack on mine and my friends (we are few in this hick-town) subculture.

I have been working ever since school began to get this ban abolished. I have over 195 names on a petition. I have spoken with the Elementary School Principal (our schools are connected) and she is on our side. I have written a letter to the Superattendant and am trying to get a meeting with him.

I would really love some input on this subject, and maybe some ideas to help get this straightened out.

Peter · 09-01-2005, 09:10 AM

Have you asked the school what the 'gothic' style of dress actually is? It may be worth considering that you may not be dressing gothic to their definition if part of their definition is distracting (which I'm going to guess really means revealing).

edible_eye · 09-01-2005, 09:26 AM

oh, and sakred winter - thanx for the intro. you posted. welcome. it sounds like you're approaching the subject in a way supposedly responsible adults will respond to - one way or another. good luck with it.

peter's suggestion is also valid - get a written list of what is and isn't acceptable. then you'll know what you're workng with.

Star of Blight · 09-01-2005, 10:00 AM

I never had to deal with anything like this when I was in school. Well no that's a lie, I did have to deal with it once. Funny story too, so grab a smoke and a seat while I tell you about it.

My senior year of highschool was a joke. I really hated school and wanted to get out early, but instead of going the Continuation School/GED route like most people I instead busted my ass for the first three years so that I would have much to do my senior year and could slack off, go me. So I only had to be there for a couple of required classes, one semester of American Gov (what a riot that class was, gag me with a spoon), English (which I slept through most of the time since I had already done all the required reading when I was in grade school, Scarlet Letter can suck my left nut and make the right one jealous) and then I was required to do some electives. One of which I decided was gonna be a teachers assistant period for my old physics teach.

So one day I'm sitting there in class, plugging grades into the teachers computer when there's an announcement made over the PA telling all the teachers to turn on their TV's to CNN. I'm not paying attention at all really, shit like this happened all the time at my school (they wanted us to be socially aware or some shit like that, as if most of the students actually gave two shits as to what was happening in the real world, and I trust media news about as much as I trust a rabid dog). After a couple of minutes of general silence I finally look up to see what the hell everyones watching and being so stoic about, and sure enough it's Columbine and the Trenchcoat Mafia, here to make the next couple months of my life a living hell.

Well we all know the negative fallout from that little fiasco, in fact I'm sure some of you had to deal with the same crap I did. Hell I almost wasn't allowed to attend my graduation ceremony because they were afraid I was gonna bomb it or some shit.

Yeah, me with a couple pounds of nitro strapped to me. If I'm gonna go out in a blaze of glory it's not gonna be like that. I'm gonna leap off the roof of a theater with a dozen running chainsaws strapped to my body and plunge headfirst into a crowd of people coming out from seeing a showing of the latest Disney animated crap-o-rama. Explosives are for pussies.

But yeah, since then I really haven't gotten much in the way of discrimination. Yeah I get odd looks on my way to and from work alot (since I take mass transit everywhere...look at me I'm eco friendly!) and I always get the jokes from my coworkers on if I'm gonna dress like a "normal person" for halloween. I dunno, my friends say I give off this general aura of "don't fuck with me" that keeps most shitheads away, which works just fine for me. They also claim that it keeps most women away too, which is a bit of a mixed blessing in my book. I mean I don't get the retard airheads or the drama bitches who drive me insane. But it does cut down on the sexlife a bit too, which I must say does suck.

Okay I'm rambling now, someone please tell me to shut the fuck up.

Empty_Purple_Stars · 09-01-2005, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Star of Blight

If I'm gonna go out in a blaze of glory it's not gonna be like that. I'm gonna leap off the roof of a theater with a dozen running chainsaws strapped to my body and plunge headfirst into a crowd of people coming out from seeing a showing of the latest Disney animated crap-o-rama.

Explosives are for pussies.

See, it's moments like this, that make me proud to be an American..

Someone get me a Kleenex, and get this guy a nice, fat, joint and two HAWT Asian Hookers..

Although I get Asian Hooker #2..

So we're clear..

Membership has privleges..

Ha..

Oh and the new guy just made it into my book of quotes for the THIRD time..

MrMaelstrom · 09-01-2005, 10:19 AM

For the ones that just stumbled onto this and are wondering why so many deleted posts, the answer is that a few members (myself included) threadjacked this thread.

The reason why I didn't write down the reason why in every post is... I really don't care about it. I'm a moderator and need to justify myself to no one here. If the Gods above don't like it, they can just kick me out, 'cause I'm easy like that.

Now, back to topic:

Is "gothic" attire specifically mentioned in the list of unnacceptable dress code, or do you just assume it to be so?

Are just goths discriminated? I ask this because there are plenty of other reasons for some dress codes to be considered in bad taste at school.

A lot of teens like to show off expensive brand names and ridicule the ones who lack the "taste" or the finantial power to do the same. It isn't fair on the others.

If a sprouting teen girl decides she's gonna get herself a bf and comes to school more underessed than actually dressed, the dress code imposed at school might save her from looking ridiculous.

And while we're at it, a lot of goths do look ridiculous depending on where you find them and at what times of day and on what specific occasions. I find that someone dressing for school like they were about to go clubbing is totally innapropriatte.

I believe that night clubs should always have the right to decide who goes in based on dress code alone, and really don't see why a school shouldn't do the same, seen as there are a lot more pressing reasons for them to do so.

I never went to private schools in Australia because I hated the idea of a school uniform (I hated ties), but they do make sense when you find that you're being ridiculed and made fun of because you're not wearing the latest Air Jordans, or when you basically don't care what you look like at a place you go to in order to acquire an EDUCATION...

Moving on....

Kettu · 09-01-2005, 03:06 PM

my school just doesnt really care. I mean as long as your not naked, or hurting someone, your fine.

Flirting_With_Suicide · 09-01-2005, 08:53 PM

MY school kicks all of your schools butts. For one my high school has less then 300 kids thew all the grades. 2nd after u climb the 3 step latter u get in to college classes and under 4 years u leave with a two year college degree. 3rd on thursdays we go at 8;30Am and get out at 11;Am. 4th its not a cathlic school but it is an old church with a realy big campus with lots a trees and not that much ass falt. and last. How many can say there school had a grave yard that wasnt made by the students but that has been there for 50 years or so. oh yes. my school has that, no one has been here scense the first year it was made smell.

But at my school it is all anti gang. They actually like us "goths" at my school were we get the favor. Cuz we are consitered artistic or what ever.

Fenris · 09-01-2005, 09:56 PM

A black shirt, black pants, and a pentacle necklace was as goth as I ever got at school, but they never seemed to have a problem with it. In fact, they were much more likely to crack down on sexually suggestive and/or alcohol or drug related attire worn more by hicks and preps. At the time, the general principal of limiting people dress in a public place (it'd be different if we had the option not to go to school) pissed me off, but at least it was enforced well and (mostly) fairly. Though I'm sure a Cradle of Filth t-shirt wouldn't have gone over quite as well as a comparable Christian shirt....

Spazik · 09-01-2005, 10:34 PM

You seem pretty mature for a high school kid. Check it out, it's funny you mention this, because in MY hicktown they told a seventh grade boy he couldn't wear eyeliner, even though girls could. He and his mom checked the rule book very carefully and then brought the ACLU down on their Republican asses. If you're really serious, there are people in high places willing to protect your civil liberties.

Sakred_Winter · 09-02-2005, 10:59 AM

I understand your point of veiw totally Maelstrom. But...Im a goth that likes to come to school with very little skin showing at all. What makes me mad is the fact that they banned 'sleeve-lets', its what I call them, theyre long, fingerless gloves, Im sure you all know what they are. But, when I wear short-sleeved shirts I get really self-conscious of the hair on my arms, plus I have alot of deep scars on my left arm. They also banned one of my freind's contacts (they looked like zombie eyes, they were cool), they also banned sweatbands, and leather bracelets. Also, the same freind busted for his contacts was asked not to wear his boots to school anymore because they had to many laces!
Dress Code Rule #9:
'Clothing (any) which creates a disturbance (can include gothic, but not limited to) or expresses obscenities or vulgarity. This includes clothing that mimics jail or institutional attire, have offensive gestures, provocative slogans, or can be misconstrued as offensive, including a phrase that could have a risque or suggestive meaning.'
This is all to general to be lawful! ANYTHING can be made into a suggestive slogan! Ugh! I still need my meeting with the superattendant, it probably wont happen for a few days since all the stuff that has happened recently. But Im still trying!

Also, it is unlawful to allow girls to do one thing and not the boys, as well as the other way around. It enforces gender stereotypes. Our principal told the boys at the beginning of the year that since he didnt like it when anything was touching his knees that they could wear shorts above their knees, but the girls couldnt. I think hes a fag.

And I like you alot Star of Blight!!

Spazik · 09-02-2005, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sakred_Winter

I understand your point of veiw totally Maelstrom. But...Im a goth that likes to come to school with very little skin showing at all. What makes me mad is the fact that they banned 'sleeve-lets', its what I call them, theyre long, fingerless gloves, Im sure you all know what they are. But, when I wear short-sleeved shirts I get really self-conscious of the hair on my arms, plus I have alot of deep scars on my left arm. They also banned one of my freind's contacts (they looked like zombie eyes, they were cool), they also banned sweatbands, and leather bracelets. Also, the same freind busted for his contacts was asked not to wear his boots to school anymore because they had to many laces!
Dress Code Rule #9:
'Clothing (any) which creates a disturbance (can include gothic, but not limited to) or expresses obscenities or vulgarity. This includes clothing that mimics jail or institutional attire, have offensive gestures, provocative slogans, or can be misconstrued as offensive, including a phrase that could have a risque or suggestive meaning.'
This is all to general to be lawful! ANYTHING can be made into a suggestive slogan! Ugh! I still need my meeting with the superattendant, it probably wont happen for a few days since all the stuff that has happened recently. But Im still trying!

Also, it is unlawful to allow girls to do one thing and not the boys, as well as the other way around. It enforces gender stereotypes. Our principal told the boys at the beginning of the year that since he didnt like it when anything was touching his knees that they could wear shorts above their knees, but the girls couldnt. I think hes a fag.

And I like you alot Star of Blight!!

I protested my school by dropping out and getting my G.E.D., just like I protest federal politics by not voting. If they pull that bullshit on you, cut them out of your life, like a cancer. If enough people do it, maybe they'll change their ways. If not, it's not a part of you anymore,anyways, so it doesn't even matter.

Sakred_Winter · 09-02-2005, 11:13 AM

I can't drop out of school though, both my mom and my boyfriend will be upset. Besides, I'm trying to get an art scholarship. I have the same ideas about government, that its all a conspiriacy and our votes dont matter. But can it really hurt? Vote for the GREEN party! lol
Instead of ignoring it, Im trying to change it, Im a Senior this year, I could just say I dont give a flying fuck and roll with it and try to ignore it.
But I have alot of friends that are Juniors and Sophmores and Freshmen and I want to make the school system fair for them, since theyre stuck here for a few more years. Plus, I think I can get it done, people have been telling me I sound like a political advisor and shit. Its funny

Spazik · 09-02-2005, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sakred_Winter

I can't drop out of school though, both my mom and my boyfriend will be upset. Besides, I'm trying to get an art scholarship. I have the same ideas about government, that its all a conspiriacy and our votes dont matter. But can it really hurt? Vote for the GREEN party! lol
Instead of ignoring it, Im trying to change it, Im a Senior this year, I could just say I dont give a flying fuck and roll with it and try to ignore it.
But I have alot of friends that are Juniors and Sophmores and Freshmen and I want to make the school system fair for them, since theyre stuck here for a few more years. Plus, I think I can get it done, people have been telling me I sound like a political advisor and shit. Its funny

Whats funny to me is that gothic dress is looked down upon more than the ghetto ass...negroids wearing their fubu or jerseys and baggy pants or whatever the hell. Their style of dress and idols promote gang violence and idolize going to prison, robbing people, etc. When I was a kid, the worst thing me and my goth friends ever did was drink forties under the train bridge with some gutter punks. Whoop de doo. But because we have white face paint and spiked collars we're somehow worse. Is it a crime to look nice? I guess to some 60 year old man with a tucked in collared shirt and belted pants up above his belly button. News flash: You look dumb! Don't force that on us. But nobody understands. I guess it's part of being old.

Fenris · 09-04-2005, 01:53 AM

Immorality is considered to be a far less grievous sin than percieved immorality. At least America's school systems seem to behave so at times. As deplorable as hip-hop subculture may be, it is now the mainstream, and so it will get away with far more than it's fair share of transgressions against common morality. In addition, goth dress offends traditional christian values which is almost always look upon more harshly than offending typical common sense values. You can be goth fairly easily in most places, you just have to avoid appearing anti-christian and you're usually left alone. And, goth as we know it has been around for about 25 years, and the punk which spawned goth has been around even longer, hip hop will fade into it's proper place in obscurity soon enough, and our schools will choose to ignore the next immoralistic degrading subculture to take it's place, but hopefully the next one will be more goth friendly, so there's always hope.

Disfunction · 09-04-2005, 05:52 AM

Just be glad you don't have to wear uniforms. 'Nough said!

Metatron · 09-05-2005, 01:45 PM

I know some schools have a 'no chains' rule in the dress code, but going as far as banning gothic dress is overkill.

Spazik · 09-05-2005, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metatron

I know some schools have a 'no chains' rule in the dress code, but going as far as banning gothic dress is overkill.

I can understand no chains or spiked collars, but it's just dumb to allow a government institution to stifle a minor's individuality, in my opinion.

Sakred_Winter · 09-06-2005, 10:36 AM

I should get a meeting with the superattendant sometime this week, hopefully.

The "no chains and spikes" rule I can understand, but we can't even wear collars with studs, or in my friend's case, little skull-and-crossbones metal insignias.

Spazik · 09-06-2005, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sakred_Winter

I should get a meeting with the superattendant sometime this week, hopefully.

The "no chains and spikes" rule I can understand, but we can't even wear collars with studs, or in my friend's case, little skull-and-crossbones metal insignias.

The type of people that become public school teachers are the type that like to form others, tell them what to do, crush opposition, and opress indiviuality. Theres a reason they go through extra college for shitty pay. It takes a special kind of person to teach public school, just like a cop.

Sakred_Winter · 09-07-2005, 11:02 AM

Kind of like a nun, willing to take pay cuts so she can beat you, lol.

Theres a concert going on at my school Spt. 23, Im trying to get as many ppl to go as I can

Black Gestalt · 09-14-2005, 10:37 PM

My school is fine with it, and I think it adds to the school. People express themselves, so they don't feel intimidated to express their viewpoints in class, etc.

NoneSuch · 09-15-2005, 11:30 AM

Oh god you americans are lucky .. Us brits get school uniforms we have to wear.... Yay........ *Cries*

Just be happy you get to put on your own clothes when you go to school..

Kampf · 09-15-2005, 01:40 PM

This is what I think of things. You go to school to do what? Learn. That is all. When you do go to school, you basically give your implied consent that you will follow the rules. If you do not wish to comply with the set regulations, you can be home schooled or drop out. If the current principal thinks something should be banned then there is not much you can do about it, no matter how stupid it is.

My only advice is that of you want things to change, simply talk to him yourself. If all else fails look at it like this. you won't be able to wear goth cloths for 6 hours a day. Even then, it doesn't really distinguish you, in my opinion, from the rest of the masses at your school. You stated that you are the only goths in a "hick-town". So that means, unless you only dress goth, that your thought patterns are different from those around you. This means that you are already seperated from those around you and the loss of choice in cloths shouldn't really effect the state of things. Also I doubt the teachers would prohibit you from wearing dark cloths. Nothing distracting, just dark. But these are only my thoughts on things and shouldn't be taken in too much seriousness.

soggypicklemuncher · 09-16-2005, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrMaelstrom

I believe that night clubs should always have the right to decide who goes in based on dress code alone, and really don't see why a school shouldn't do the same, seen as there are a lot more pressing reasons for them to do so.

The difference there is that a nightclub is a privately owned business while a school is a public institution. Unless a kid can afford to go to a private school (which would be counterproductive anyway since a private school can have whatever dress code it wants), he/she has to go to public school, and I think a very strict dress code that's basically made to fit the whims of the school board is unfair. I understand wanting to tone down on nudity and encourage personal hygiene, but banning bright hair colors or unusual clothes is just an attempt to control teenagers, whose budding independence is threatening.

And school board members are afraid that kids who dress "punk" or "goth" will make their schools look bad.

I had an experience with this kind of discrimination in eighth grade. I started dying my hair around that time, and I went to the office a couple times and was told I had to dye it a "natural" color. I think I'd bleached it blonde one time and dyed it a very purple burgundy the other. My teachers didn't care and after the first day I came to school with different hair the other kids were used to it (so much for "distracting" hair colors) but when the principal or vice principal saw me in the hall they called me to the office.

I complied with their wishes each time this happened, dying my hair another color that they were okay with and probably damaging my hair by using so many chemicals on it in such a short time period. Then, during Christmas break, I dyed my hair a very bright red, I think pillarbox red or something like that from Jerome Russell Punky Colours. Well, I didn't get a chance to dye my hair a school-appropriate color before I went back (didn't get a second color of dye when I got the red and Sally's was closed) and my parents wouldn't let me stay home, so I wore a beanie in the hope that I wouldn't draw attention to myself with my flaming clown-esque hair.

Well as my luck would have it, no head coverings at all were allowed at my junior high, so my Algebra I teacher made me take it off and when she saw my hair I of course had to go to the office. By then the big cheeses of the school were getting pissed at me, and they sent me to a remedial school for one school week. It was called Rescue, where you're not allowed to wear any jewelry and everyone has to go through metal detectors. It wasn't all that bad, except we had to follow all these rules like walking along one side of the hall single file whenever a class went somewhere, and I got behind on my real schoolwork.

I guess what I'm saying is that how I decided to look wouldn't have adversely affected my or anyone else's education if the school administration hadn't decided to get its panties in a bunch over it. Teenagers aren't goldfish with a two-minute memory - they get used to seeing people who have changed their outward appearance. I didn't get in trouble for coming in to school one day with braces even though people noticed and gave me attention for it; and people who dye their hair a color that is noticeably different from their natural color but still fits the dress code get attention from people simply because they look different, but the novelty quickly wears off and everybody gets back to business as usual.

If teachers and principals worked more on relating to their students and getting them to enjoy learning instead of punishing them for experimenting with clothing, hairstyles, and makeup, academic performance would be better and there would be much less resentment between teens and adults in authority positions.

Oh, a final little thing to close this post:

When I came back for my ninth grade year, I got sick of my hair which was basically one big fluffball from bleaching an dying it so much, so I shaved my head. I left bangs but everything else went. I got called to the office, but since there was nothing anybody could do about and technically it didn’t violate any rules, Mr. Edwards just shook his head and sent me back to class. It was a nice little personal victory, although I suffered for it because it was getting colder out and, being in marching band, I spent a lot of time outside. My uniform hat fit kind of funny with no hair to secure it on my head, heh. But I liked it when random people came up and rubbed my stubble. ;D