Veganism

[Cicero]

No amount of trying will save you from death, but there are measures you can take to try and prevent it for as long as possible. It's worth it just for the small difference you can make, even if it's all an uphill battle.

[Graveyard.Crow]

Originally Posted by Saddiction

Don't forget about hair dye. Hmmm I wonder if vegans dye their hair. GC, you're a vegan, what brand of hair dye do you use?

Now I'm afraid to say.
I've used too many to name.

[Graveyard.Crow]

Originally Posted by Cicero

So what if there's absolutely no way for us to exist without animal cruelty? At least vegans and vegetarians TRY.

I'm going to use that the next time someone tells me I'm not helping anything.

[††BlackRose††]

I personally am a Vegetarian (due to religion) but I don't ever plan on eating meat. So I agree with Cicero and Graveyard.Crow in this one.

[da fetus]

if you're vegan and smoke ciggarettes you're not vegan and also you're an idiot.

[Valerius]

I like my meat rare. Gimme a bloody steak any day of the week.

And don't shoot me, GC. :P

[Bete Noire]

I am quite definitely not a vegan, I loves my meat too much.... That aside, I have a lot of respect for vegans/vegitarians.

I generally try to eat local produce as much as possible, although I'm not brilliant at it.

[Saddiction]

Originally Posted by Graveyard.Crow

Now I'm afraid to say.
I've used too many to name.

Well maybe you should research this for next time, since Clairol (nice 'n easy) is a company that (to my knowledge) tests on animals. Not that it really matters.

[LadyLucretia]

I don't get down on vegans if it's just another aspect of someone's personality. But I have known far too many college students who considered it a "statement" they were making, and clearly got off on restricting themselves because it seemed to validate their self righteous attitude.

Example: when I started college I was no more immune to Cause Head Syndrome than anyone else. My cause du jour was child labor. I didn't want to buy clothing that was made from child labor. Well, this left me with only a handful of stores to shop in, several of which weren't in my city at all. Not having a car made getting to the rest of them challenging. I soon realized that if I was going to manage this feat, I'd spent so much money on transportation or shipping fees ordering online that it would cut into my food budget. So I decided that eating, and not dropping out of school due to malnutrition, was more important than "the cause."

So basically, I think any protest statement like mine or like veganism has it's ultimate limits. And I don't know that having a small minority of people supporting these practices actually does anything constructive. So while I have no problem with vegans, I ultimately think that it's just another foolish and ineffectual statement. But there are worse strains of idealism one could have, so overall I don't find it that objectionable.

I like animals more than people. I also like eating animals more than I like eating people. I'm a meatatarian.

[dreamydancer]

Originally Posted by da fetus

if you're vegan and smoke ciggarettes you're not vegan and also you're an idiot.

Thank you. I've been waiting for somebody to agree with me.

[dreamydancer]

My mentality is a lot more conventional than people give me credit for. I love me a juicey hunk of meat just as much as the next person. I have always believed in the food chain and will never understand how some people can value the lives of animals over humans. Mankind is meant to feed on whatever it can hunt and gather.

I live and let others live but for fuck's sake I get tired of listening to alternative kids who are bisexal and vegetarian trying to be so cool. "Oh, look at me I'm wearing a PETA shirt." Good for you to represent some asswipes who abuse animals themselves and are full of shit. They brainwash stupid little kids who have never realized, "Oh, my gawd!!! I can't believe they kill the food that I eat."

Don't worry. Calm down people, I'm not finished. For real vegetarians/vegans who are well justified in their reasons I really hand it to them. They have more self discipline than I will ever be able to accomplish in my lifetime. After gaining twenty pounds since last year I still struggle to get back to a healthier diet. How much more if I can't have any meat or dairy products once in a while? Then it would be a good time to shoot myself in the head. Figuratively speaking, of course.

[Graveyard.Crow]

Originally Posted by Valerius

I like my meat rare. Gimme a bloody steak any day of the week.

And don't shoot me, GC. :P

I won't don't worry

[Graveyard.Crow]

Originally Posted by dreamydancer

My mentality is a lot more conventional than people give me credit for. I love me a juicey hunk of meat just as much as the next person. I have always believed in the food chain and will never understand how some people can value the lives of animals over humans. Mankind is meant to feed on whatever it can hunt and gather.

I live and let others live but for fuck's sake I get tired of listening to alternative kids who are bisexal and vegetarian trying to be so cool. "Oh, look at me I'm wearing a PETA shirt." Good for you to represent some asswipes who abuse animals themselves and are full of shit. They brainwash stupid little kids who have never realized, "Oh, my gawd!!! I can't believe they kill the food that I eat."

Don't worry. Calm down people, I'm not finished. For real vegetarians/vegans who are well justified in their reasons I really hand it to them. They have more self discipline than I will ever be able to accomplish in my lifetime. After gaining twenty pounds since last year I still struggle to get back to a healthier diet. How much more if I can't have any meat or dairy products once in a while? Then it would be a good time to shoot myself in the head. Figuratively speaking, of course.

I agree with you. It isn't a trend, or at least not meant to be.
And to comment on another person's post. If I were starving and animal products were the only thing I could eat, I would probaly eat them. The reason why I can be vegan is because at this point in time, I can afford to.

[Cicero]

Originally Posted by Graveyard.Crow

If I were starving and animal products were the only thing I could eat, I would probaly eat them. The reason why I can be vegan is because at this point in time, I can afford to.

Same here.

This is why I go a little less strict when I'm travelling - some parts of the world just don't have enough vegetarian foods to make vegetarianism effective sustainence (e.g. rural Azerbaijan, where the only thing available apart from game meat or lamb is bread). In these situations I'll eat meat if it's served to me, but I've got to admit I don't enjoy it at all.

[james"bloody tears"]

personally i dont think i could be a vegan i like my meat to much. however i agree with what said about the mass raised cow thing, they are treated cruel and i refuse to eat em, i raise kill and eat my own thank you.

[Godslayer Jillian]

You know what would reduce animal cruelty, animal killing, need for forest clearings, and many other aspects within and beyond the vegan ethic?
Promoting population reduction.

[Graveyard.Crow]

Originally Posted by Cicero

Same here.

This is why I go a little less strict when I'm travelling - some parts of the world just don't have enough vegetarian foods to make vegetarianism effective sustainence (e.g. rural Azerbaijan, where the only thing available apart from game meat or lamb is bread). In these situations I'll eat meat if it's served to me, but I've got to admit I don't enjoy it at all.

Meat, I find it just too gross to eat
But I would eat yougurt if I really had to, or cheese if I had nothing else.
Meat for me is like eating shit, VERY VERY last resort. LOL

[Tristanna]

I'm allergic to dairy products and anything containing wheat like bread or pasta so vegan restaurants are GREAT for me, i can get ice cream and things there which i ca never get in normal restaurants.

I do eat meat but if i had a normal choice i wouldn't, due to health issue above and having to kep my blood sugar stable i really have to ear meat/fish to keep things balanced. Theres already so much i cant eat it would make things impossible if i now cut meat out.

I was a vegetarian for years before my health issues.

I think its a personal choice but biologically we wouldnt have advanced to how we are with this large brain size comparatively if we hadnt started eating meat, it was when we did that our brains grew tremendously with the high protein intake. Im not saying we need it now just that people should acknowledge it got us to where we are now.

[TopHaggardDoll]

I've been a vegetarian for 12 years...a damn long time. The longer you are, the less you have that silly PETA attitude. I don't care if other people eat meat...I just don't fucking want to.

I don't like the industry and I wont support it.

[Graveyard.Crow]

This thread is giving me a tiny vegan orgasm

[viscus]

Diet is just a lifestyle choice, I don't judge people on it unless they're self-righteous about it. Myself, I was a vegetarian for a while, when a pollo-vegetarian, and now just an omnivore who tries to avoid red meat for the most part.

I think the health benefits of vegetarian/veganism are overblown. Humans are a hunter/gatherer species, our bodies are perfectly set up to handle both a plant and meat diet. What kind of kills me is all the "raw foods" believers who don't cook anything because it's the most "natural." They fail to realize that cooking actually releases more of the nutrients in a lot of foods.

There is a case to be made, however, for the economic and environmental inviability of the meat and dairy industries. It's a lot of land that has to be cleared for the grazing of cattle, which could be otherwise left as a natural preserve or used for other crops. Also, the grain or corn used to fatten up pigs and cattle could be used to feed a lot more people than the meat from said pigs and cattle.

[NachtSorcier]

Originally Posted by Godslayer Jillian

You know what would reduce animal cruelty, animal killing, need for forest clearings, and many other aspects within and beyond the vegan ethic?
Promoting population reduction.

That's why Mother Nature made people like me.

[honeythorn]

I agree with Viscus on the score of what we are designed to eat.

I also honestly think that farming of animals should be seriously scaled down. It will never stop completeley since it is far too ingrained in human cultures across the globe, and those who love meat or don't care will simply just continue anyway. There will always be a demand.

I think that the farming of animals should be scaled right back to a more local level. Here in the UK, a vast number of small family farms have been steadily wiped out because of commercial factory farming. Counties such as Yorkshire used to be full of small local farms all over the dales , and there are still a fair few, but large scale dairy and beef farming has caused many families to simply give up the whole lot. They just can't compete, or get good prices for their produce.

Also, if farming were to be scaled down to local levels, I think people may ( I am not saying definitely as I cannot prove it ) be rather more inclined to take better care of their stock, since they would have a lot to lose by having unhealthy and badly treated animals.



Myself, I do not eat any red meat. I do not like the taste at all. I rarely eat chicken , and I do not like fish either.

[Demyx]

I can understand how Vegans think...but I suffer from a chronic lack of motivation and so giving up meat,(which I love more than ...well...allot of things) it's too much effort on my part to get vitamins and all the research into products, clothing, cosmetics, and whatnot.

[Cicero]

Originally Posted by Tristanna

I think its a personal choice but biologically we wouldnt have advanced to how we are with this large brain size comparatively if we hadnt started eating meat, it was when we did that our brains grew tremendously with the high protein intake. Im not saying we need it now just that people should acknowledge it got us to where we are now.

Don't forget that the 'meat = protein = huge brain size' theory is just that: a theory. And recent DNA evidence has been challenging it rather convincingly.

(Long explanation starts here)
There's a gene that codes for amylase - the enzyme that breaks down starch - that we have many copies of in our DNA, probably due to large amounts of starch in our ancestor's diets. Chimpanzees and other modern apes have very few copies of this gene due to very little starch in their diets - in fact they can be rather carnivorous at times. It has been hypothesised that it was in fact an increase in starch, not meat, that led to the enourmous leap in brain capacity. The hypothesis is not only supported by our genome, but by the way in which hominid teeth are more suited to grinding plant matter than tearing flesh. Isotope ratios in fossils also suggest a plant-rich diet. It can't be made for certain, however, until we're able to pinpoint the exact time that the amylase gene mutations occured. If it turns out to have happened between 1.5 to 3 million years ago... well, lets just say anyone with that particular argument against vegetarianism won't have much of a leg to stand on.

(Information taken from the article "Tubers, the brain food of choice?" in the 15 September, 2007 issue of New Scientist)