You're really not goth.

KontanKarite · 12-22-2007, 03:53 PM

So my dad was having a conversation with me about the goth subculture just a moment ago.

Funny, I'd love to know what his definition of goth is, because he was telling me that everything I was into and did had nothing to do with goth.

I think he's convinced that goth is about Manson and metal. o_0

I wouldn't mind someone who knew what they were talking about telling me that everything I was into or what not was not one thing or another, but he seriously has no idea or he truly believes that the mainstream definition of goth is the true meaning of it.

Logically, I can understand that. I'm nothing like the stereotypical metal loving "goth" that media tries to sell everyone.

I suppose the shame is, he doesn't entirely care to listen. Hell, maybe I'm not a goth at all. Maybe I don't really care that much. Just thought the conversation was interesting.

Underwater Ophelia · 12-22-2007, 04:51 PM

That sucks, but at least now you know that you really aren't goth, and Manson, spiked dog collars, and corpse paint are.

Calling ourselves "goth."
Boy, are our faces red!

LaBelleDameSansMerci · 12-22-2007, 05:05 PM

My mom was (still is? I don't know?) convinced that goth is about self-injury death.

KontanKarite · 12-22-2007, 05:38 PM

Yeah. I honestly don't CARE so much. I just find it oddly curious.

I think the development of it all though, the idea that I would "need" the word goth to define what I like is rather moot.

I guess I don't really care what the definition of the word is anymore. Goth can be all about corpse paint and manson these days. The stuff I like will be there all the time. I think I've come to a point in life where I don't need the word "goth" as the identity. I don't even care if the definition of goth becomes entirely inaccurate anymore.

Steppenwolf · 12-22-2007, 06:21 PM

If "being a normal goth" means to care about topics like "goth flag" , "my dark room" , "my dark tastes" , then ... Goth for you , not for me (thanks) ...

Yes , the definition of "goth" has become totally innacurate on the mainstream and even inside the very own subculture , but I believe that this definition was inaccurate even in the 80's ... And just try to imagine what WILL BE this definition on 2015 or 2020 ...

Don't call yourself goth , man , why should you??? (I'll love you anyway if you are good enough to be loved ...)

Fuck the labels ...

fiends · 12-22-2007, 07:27 PM

I am anti-label-ist.
I am who I am... just a regular dark fella who likes to be around other dark people. ._.

Methadrine · 12-22-2007, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiends

I am anti-label-ist.
I am who I am... just a regular dark fella who likes to be around other dark people. ._.

There's your label right there, though. It's inevitable.

Kanedawg · 12-22-2007, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiends

I am anti-label-ist.
I am who I am... just a regular dark fella who likes to be around other dark people. ._.

Could not have put it better myself. I am an INDIVIDUAL. Hello?!

As for the metal assocition with goth, I am old school here. In the (19)80s, the vibe was not associated with metal but more atmospheric stuff like Souxsie and the Banshees and of course Bauhaus and they are NOT metal. And I LIKE metal, and all kinds of other stuff. And I am not goth in any card carrying clearly definable sense, but I am dark. And other things too! El oh well! FUCK labels, already. A lot of cool people on this site, which is what matters more to me than anything because I have a hard time liking many people in general.

dark_dragon_of_ice · 12-22-2007, 07:48 PM

Who cares just say its something else its just a dam name you can still have your that you love music you love and wear what you want..

fiends · 12-22-2007, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Methadrine

There's your label right there, though. It's inevitable.

._.
But...
That's a vague one, at least.

I suppose what I mean is I don't strive to fit in with any one crowd.

Godslayer Jillian · 12-22-2007, 07:59 PM

You fit exactly in in the dark crowd, don't you?

dark_dragon_of_ice · 12-22-2007, 08:00 PM

I fit into the Nicks awesome crowd of currently one person...

KontanKarite · 12-22-2007, 08:25 PM

Yeah... clarifying here. I'm not really at all heartbroke about it.

It's almost full circle kind of... There was a time I was who I was before knowing what "goth" actually was and then I identified with it, then now.. it's back to just as I always was anyway. Nothing's changed at all...

Kanedawg · 12-22-2007, 08:33 PM

Sorry I was a little bent. Part of it is Christmas and all for me I'm sure. :^)

As labels go in contemporary reductionist terms, I think we're all "consumers," now, anyway. Doesn't matter if you're a 7-year-old Asian girl in a sweatshop or Donald Trump or a Pigmy chieftan or a lesbian or an Iraqi or a G.I. or a rock star or a goth. You're a "consumer." In that sense all niggling individuality is washed away nice and clean. :^)

LaBelleDameSansMerci · 12-22-2007, 08:38 PM

I....
don't know.

Godslayer Jillian · 12-22-2007, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanedawg

As labels go in contemporary reductionist terms, I think we're all "consumers," now, anyway. Doesn't matter if you're a 7-year-old Asian girl in a sweatshop or Donald Trump or a Pigmy chieftan or a lesbian or an Iraqi or a G.I. or a rock star or a goth. You're a "consumer." In that sense all niggling individuality is washed away nice and clean. :^)

I like that. Not that I'm a consumer; but that it's true, and someone acknowledges it. That's all that we are unless we change it. Nothing that we are in this society matters because we still only are within this society, and it doesn't acknowledge individual identity. All feelings of freedom and individuality in the world are but illusions, societal constructs. We won't be but piano keys in a world that only acknowledges us as much.

Kanedawg · 12-22-2007, 09:45 PM

Thank you. The whole consumer thing really irks me. From the paragon of animals to "consumer." I think that what we believe ourselves to be has a great effect on what we are, and I choose to think of myself as a person, all consumption aside. We could also be called "breathers" for that matter.

clockworkcoffin · 12-22-2007, 10:13 PM

equally annoying: people who think dnd is a cult

Graveyard.Crow · 12-22-2007, 10:40 PM

Anyone who cares about being called goth and fitting in with a crowd is missing out on my awsome clique of people who don't actually care.
Join my none conformist clique, dress like me, and you can be a none conformist too!

dark_dragon_of_ice · 12-22-2007, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clockworkcoffin

equally annoying: people who think dnd is a cult

My lich is in a cult if that counts...

AngelikDemonik · 12-23-2007, 05:38 AM

My mom thinks I'm into S&M... *shrug*

ApothoKeri · 12-23-2007, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AngelikDemonik

My mom thinks I'm into S&M... *shrug*

LOL, well mine did too for a bit, especially when we would run off to Sleep Chamber shows and such. But hey, you can easily see how someone could get that impression. It's a pretty logical assumption probably really (or would have been in my case - even though it wasn't true).

KontanKarite, You know, sometimes it best to just let people think what they want. If it makes them happy and isn't hurting anyone, then why not? Maybe your dad is a closet Marilyn Manson fan or something.

You should get him a shirt for Christmas!

JCC · 12-23-2007, 07:39 AM

Eh, Goth should be a trait, not a classification. When you have to adhere to certain rules and regulations to be a Goth is ridiculous. I mean, I'm sat here in my Jimi Hendrix shirt and blue jeans, listening to Tom Waits. Does that mean that I no longer like the Sex Gang Children and that all of those H.P. Lovecraft books are getting thrown in the bin? Fuck no, it just means that I have a bit more to me than one all-encompassing label.

I wouldn't mind being labelled a Goth. I mean, I don't like being labelled, as Soren Kierkegaard put it, "Once you label me, you negate me.", but it's not a bad label to be given. I just want to be able to have my own freedom to move within that label.

gothicusmaximus · 12-23-2007, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clockworkcoffin

equally annoying: people who think dnd is a cult

http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0046/0046_01.asp

I have to give my mom props when it comes to things like those being discussed in this thread, she doesn't fall prey to whatever misconceptions are propagated by the media and whatnot, she makes the effort to understand the things I like and then, through her own judgement, resolves to hate those things.

lostintranslation · 12-23-2007, 09:15 AM

When you boil it down, other's opinions shouldn't matter. It's your life, live it how you want to. Have a good time, and forget all the people who are in your way. Other's criticize and judge and all this nonsense, but if you let every little assumption get to you, you'll never live and be who you are. Don't take the time to label yourself based on other's opinions. You are who you are, be that person, and screw everybody else who says you're a fake, or you're not being "true" to your "culture". Life is about having a good time. So go out and have a good time!