Hey Despanan, YOU ATHEIST BASTARD!!!

[KontanKarite]

Intellectual honesty, BITCH! LoL!

No seriously, this dude is pretty sweet.

[HumanePain]

Moderation wins the day. His balanced and objective comments will win converts.

[KontanKarite]

I wouldn't say he's actually moderate at all. Intellectual honesty doesn't pardon superstition and he didn't give credence to the idea that someone's personal spiritual experience is something you should tack onto religious beliefs, but to simple human experience.

Make no mistake, he's not moderate in the least bit. But he's certainly palatable.

[HumanePain]

I misspoke: in my opinion as a Christian, I saw it as moderate that he actually said Islam has caused more human grief than Christianity. That is a departure from what I normally hear from atheists; the usual comment is that "the Crusades and other Christian nations have killed more people than anyone" (sometimes they throw in Hitler's victims).

That kind of comment, although admittedly distressing to some Christians makes Christianity seem the lesser of two evils, as his anecdote relates about the Sunni Muslim fighting with the American soldiers. This keeps Christians listening instead of turning off immediately.

[ape descendant]

What's my problem?

Thank you CapnOrdinary.

[Despanan]

Hmmm...

Dude has a point.

While I'm not sure it's feasible to actually eliminate the title of "atheist" from rational non-believers at this time, adopting that label does open us up for all sorts of rhetorical attacks. Theists have also managed to brand that term with a particularly negative connotation as well.

(For instance, when I think "Atheist" the word feels to me to be harsh reds and blacks. When I think "Theist" my brain conjures up greens and blues and whites)

Which is why I think it's better to say that "a government should be primarily non-religious" than "a government should be primarily atheist". They both mean exatly the same thing, yet the latter seems much harsher and more militant.

Sill, those of us who are rational enough to reject supernatural claims DESPERATELY need some sort of organization, and while I think a positive connontation like "rationalist" or "reason-based-thinker" might sound more palatable than "atheism" as a title "atheism" is much more iconic.

I really agree that we need to avoid being overly even-handed (and this is a liberal tendencie as well as an atheist tendency). Islam IS a far greater threat than Chrisitianity, and Mormonism is WAY more ridiculous than Protestantism or Catholocism. It's a liberal and reasonable tendency to want to turn the microscope on one's own culture as well, but I think it serves us poorly in a rhetorical battle.

That said, I'm not about to start attacking Islam left and right. That religion allready gets enough hate (especially here in the western world). Similarly, unless provoked, I'm probably not going to go after Buddhism, Hinduism, or the Amish because they're far less of a threat to the things I like than Chrisitianity, Mormonism, and Scientology.

So yeah, it's all silly stories, but some silly stories are more dangerous than others.

[ape descendant]

The term atheist =/= non religious necessarily. An atheist merely lacks a belief in a god or gods, one can be an atheist and be religious. There are atheist Buddhists and Raelians that prove this point.

[Despanan]

Shut up. ten characters

[ape descendant]

*blush* I love it when you talk dirty to me Des... oooh...

[Despanan]

I will straight take a shit on your chest.

[ape descendant]

Awe, no one has ever done that for me before.