Hating People Who Abuse Religon Thread

Catch · 01-09-2008, 09:22 PM

It really iritates me and maybe you too, when someone hurts people and uses religon to back it up. Religons are in place so people DO NOT HURT OTHER PEOPLE!

My biggest peeves are related to men treating badly, of course. You may have some other pet peeves.

Number 1, Men siting Eve as being the one who ate the Fruit of Wisedom. First of all, she may have eaten it, but it was Adam who said he wouldn't eat it. There was no stipulations on Eve. Next, Adam was supposed to be Eve's leader. Where was he when she was haning out around the tree talking to Serpents. It's a dead subject. It doesn't even matter that she ate from the tree. No promises made in the first place.

Then there is the matter of the after shock of having been found eating from the tree. It says in the bible that Eve would become submissive to Adam. Somehow some jerk decided this means, "Beat your wife." It does not say you should beat your wife of women. It says that when a man finds the right woman, she will be submissive to him. There is no reason to beat her. In fact, beating your wife will lead to retaliation. So if you like running around telling women they have to be submissive to you and you are within your right to beat your wife, because the bible said so, YOU ARE AN ILLITERATE SON OF A WIFE BEATER!!!

Anyway, there is more like people enslaving other people because it was in the bible and that poor, poor woman that stoned her son's to death and is serving a life sentence now. (That was sad. I've alredy discussed that the bible has been altered through translation. If in doubt, DON'T KILL ANYONE.)

So that's it, I might start hitting people who ask, "Who ate the apple first?" Other phrases designed for personal gain and harm other people might just get a good spit in the face.

~ On a personal note, I actually went to a Christian school. Sometimes the teacher would ask if anyone believed in God. Often I was the only person with my hand up. If you don't believe in God, don't use the bible as your argument. Frankly it is a really old book and there are plenty of mariage councilors out there that will tell you, "DON'T BEAT YOUR WIFE!"

Kanedawg · 01-09-2008, 11:27 PM

Hi, Catch. I am not a fan of mysogeny. Or of macho thug guys. Or of sports and tractor pulls and the like. For what that may be worth to you. :^)

Drake Dun · 01-10-2008, 05:40 AM

Using the Bible to justify mysogyny is no distortion. On the contrary, it requires spectacular acts of creative interpretation to come to any other conclusion than that the Bible explicitly sanctions the ruthless subjugation of women.

Check out Exodus 21, for only one of many perfectly clear examples.

Drake

Shlindrea · 01-10-2008, 07:17 AM

ok...well you left out Ephesians 5:25

25Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26to make her holy, cleansing[b] her by the washing with water through the word, 27and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. 28In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29After all, no one ever hated his own body, but he feeds and cares for it, just as Christ does the church— 30for we are members of his body. 31"For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh."[c] 32This is a profound mystery—but I am talking about Christ and the church. 33However, each one of you also must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband.

never once is a wife told to love her husband...but the husband is told several times to love his wife like he loves himself and to care for her as he would himself. submit does not = slave ....and it's not about the wife kowtowing before her husband it's about her letting him lead the household and being the wife in the relationship, not the man. and it's about the man stepping up to the plate and being the spiritual leader of the family as Christ is the spiritual leader of the church

Drake Dun · 01-10-2008, 07:37 AM

Okay, so when you sell your daughter to some guy for hard cash, you shouldn't forget to admonish him to love her tender. I can dig it.

Drake

Apathy's_Child · 01-10-2008, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shlindrea

ok...well you left out Ephesians 5:25

25Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26to make her holy, cleansing[b] her by the washing with water through the word, 27and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. 28In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29After all, no one ever hated his own body, but he feeds and cares for it, just as Christ does the church— 30for we are members of his body. 31"For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh."[c] 32This is a profound mystery—but I am talking about Christ and the church. 33However, each one of you also must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband.

never once is a wife told to love her husband...but the husband is told several times to love his wife like he loves himself and to care for her as he would himself. submit does not = slave ....and it's not about the wife kowtowing before her husband it's about her letting him lead the household and being the wife in the relationship, not the man. and it's about the man stepping up to the plate and being the spiritual leader of the family as Christ is the spiritual leader of the church

Dude....... that is the weakest justification of the Bible I have ever seen.

Kanedawg · 01-10-2008, 09:28 AM

The impression I get is that people focus on aspects of the Bible that suit their purposes. Then there are various interpretations of any aspect of the Bible on top of that. I think that in its essence there are some valid concepts in the Bible and to Christ. But there are also some things that don't make sense, and versions of it all that don't jive.

It comes down to thinking for yourself, which is why I will never be a fundamentalist. This also doesn't mean that I don't believe in something more than what can be quantified. But that is part of being able to think for yourself, too.

Solumina · 01-10-2008, 09:46 AM

The thing that bothers me is how so many people base their biblical arguments on really bad translations of the bible or versions that have been changed drastically over the centuries (not to mention all of the different gospels that have been discounted as well as all of the apocryphal texts that so many people ignore just because a long time ago church officials thought that they didn't have the right focus) and this leads to so much unnecessary hate because most of the discounted versions of the bible are much more focused on being accepting of others (but hey the church was trying to eliminate competition so they wanted to demonize everyone who didn’t agree with them so these texts were thrown out)

ApothoKeri · 01-10-2008, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solumina

The thing that bothers me is how so many people base their biblical arguments on really bad translations of the bible or versions that have been changed drastically over the centuries (not to mention all of the different gospels that have been discounted as well as all of the apocryphal texts that so many people ignore just because a long time ago church officials thought that they didn't have the right focus) and this leads to so much unnecessary hate because most of the discounted versions of the bible are much more focused on being accepting of others (but hey the church was trying to eliminate competition so they wanted to demonize everyone who didn’t agree with them so these texts were thrown out)

Yea that too, not to mention those that do go by it literally should take into account that the world and humanity has changed and evolved a LOT in the last 2000ish years.

Drake Dun · 01-10-2008, 09:57 AM

Criticisms are naturally drawn against what people have chosen to believe, not what they might have chosen to believe.

Drake

Kanedawg · 01-10-2008, 10:08 AM

Hey, Solumina. I sometimes wonder what Christ himself was like and what his views would be, as compared with what generations of people have done with his words and in his name.

Solumina · 01-10-2008, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ApothoKeri

Yea that too, not to mention those that do go by it literally should take into account that the world and humanity has changed and evolved a LOT in the last 2000ish years.

and that the bible is the work of men, not the true word of God as so many seem to be convinced

For the record I do not have any dislike for people with beliefs (I love my mother dearly and she has very strong religious beliefs but she is willing to accept that not everyone has those same beliefs and instead of judging them or trying to change their views she accepts them and only discusses religion if someone else brings it up). I do, however, have great dislike for people who try to force their views on others especially small children.

Let me tell you a little story that makes my heart simply ache all because someone was trying to spread her beliefs. A few days ago my cousin came home from a friends house noticeably upset (he is in kindergarten). When his mother asked him what was wrong he told her that his friend's mommy said that if a man loves another man that he will go to hell. His mom responded by saying that some people believe that is true but mommy and daddy think that you can love whoever you want to love. He looked at her and said "so it's okay that I love daddy?"

Solumina · 01-10-2008, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanedawg

Hey, Solumina. I sometimes wonder what Christ himself was like and what his views would be, as compared with what generations of people have done with his words and in his name.

It would probably make him sick to see what has been done in his name

Kanedawg · 01-10-2008, 10:18 AM

Right. On both posts. In general I think that telling children that they or anyone is going to hell qualifies as child abuse.

Solumina · 01-10-2008, 10:30 AM

It really should. I just don't understand how people can think that teaching children hate can do anything but fuck with the kid; it isn't like children are even capable of understanding hate let alone complicated ideas such as romantic love (which most adults haven’t been able to figure out)

Kanedawg · 01-10-2008, 10:36 AM

(which most adults haven’t been able to figure out)
Well said! Hell is one of those major things that turns people against Christianity. Not only because we don't like that idea but because it appears to contradict such notions as love and forgiveness.

I think I'll get in my exercise. Have a good one.

Catch · 01-10-2008, 09:02 PM

Actcually, Shlindrea, if you could look up the part in the bible that talks about people using the bible for selfish gain. That would be great. Unforetunately, I am without bible right now.

The rough on it is that you should always watch out for those in the church that are using God's word to fatten their bellies.

It's true. Mysogeny is only one example. There are a lot of men out their figuring that if it gets her into bed, who cares. That's all they want. When it comes to other laws in Leviticus pertaining to giving a woman's father a money for taking their daughter's virginity, reguadless of whether or not their daughter was willing, then suddenly all of a sudden the biblical quotes stop.

DepthsofSpace · 01-10-2008, 09:55 PM

I think, (and I should cut my wrist and die for saying this), Huckabee handled this question of women the bes tonight in the RNC debate.

Drake Dun · 01-11-2008, 04:49 AM

What did he say?

Drake

Catch · 01-11-2008, 06:21 PM

I didn't watch that one. McCaine was way ahead. It is nice seeing Huckabee coming up in the polls. I watched him on the Sunday morning newsshows. He was good.