The U.S. government takes away citizens' rihts to fight the terrorists yet again!

heavilyrxmedicated · 12-04-2007, 10:41 PM

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-...1959is.txt.pdf

My spin on this bill:
This bill is reminiscent of the Patriot act to me... It plays off of the "terrorism threats" to our nation, but it's so much worse. The first few times it's read, the reader won't really consider the fact that a LOT of the terminology used in it is vague, such as "force", and their definitions for "Violent Radicalization" and "Homegrown Terrorism". However, if you read into it, you can easily see the Government's loopholes for deeming anyone who speaks out against something (i.e. the Government) a "terrorist", revoking that person's U.S. citizenship, and doing whatever they please to that person, whether it be torture, execution, or anything else that the U.S. wants to do (under the Geneva Convention, but HAH! Since when has the U.S. government obeyed the rules set down after WWII?). If ANYONE can disprove any of my views, PLEASE, FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THAT IS GOOD, CORRECT ME! I HOPE that it isn't as bad as it looks to me! Plus, I haven't studied an exorbitant amount of older laws, and I'm REALLY hoping that there is a contradictory law somewhere out there (i.e. the First Amendment, Habeas Corpus)... Just thought that I should post this, because I didn't see any other people posting this bill up. From what I've heard, this has already passed through the House of Representatives, and is on it's way to the Senate. If I seem like a complete newbie to the political system, it's only because I am, so CORRECT ME if anything is wrong here! But yeah, the vagueness in the definitions of those terms is a serious cause for concern that it could be misused against anyone using freedom of speech! BTW, found this on facebook, and my opinions are my own, but seem to be quite similar to those expressed there, so don't mistake my opinions for theirs...

dark_dragon_of_ice · 12-04-2007, 10:46 PM

Spaces between paragraphs (if there are any in that piece of writing) is your friend to being read ><.

heavilyrxmedicated · 12-04-2007, 11:16 PM

Oo? Waddaya mean? Have you read this bill through already? Oh, and about your name... Dark Dragon from Shining Force is my all-time favorite villan...

KontanKarite · 12-05-2007, 03:04 AM

I've heard of this bill. It's really spooky.

Drake Dun · 12-05-2007, 05:29 AM

I hate to break character, but I think people are overreacting to this. It's an alarming prelude, but at this point, it's still just a prelude... it doesn't actually make it illegal for you to do anything, or make it legal for the government to do anything to you.

The chilling indictment of the Internet and the spectacularly overbroad definitions were the only parts that really raised my hackles.

Drake

Delkaetre · 12-05-2007, 07:40 AM

You should be worried about the USA's announcement that it will kidnap citizens of other countries if it feels they've committed a crime against the US.
Example- Ms Mary Jane Watson lives in London. She visited New York last year. Her cousin, unknown to her, hid goods in her luggage so she smuggled something into the US. Ms Watson and her cousin are guilty of committing a crime against the US. If the US do not wish to go through usual channels or the British government does not wish to hand them over for some reason, the US government will simply send over agents and kidnap Ms Watson and her cousin. Ms Watson may not know what's going on till she's got a bag over head being hustled towards a plane.
I can go find you a link for this later, if you like.
The problem with the kidnapping is that it's government sanctioned kidnap. Abducting another country's citizens like that can be deemed an act of war. The US could quite easily end up finding that it had inadvertently 'declared war' on many major countries by pursuing this tactic. Not to mention that the countries affected may decide to kidnap the US agents who orchestrated the kidnap, to be tried under their own laws- wonderful vicious circle there.

Wormboy · 12-05-2007, 10:21 AM

I'm moving to Canada, who's with me?

And note the interesting post number ^_^

< 888 hehe

heavilyrxmedicated · 12-05-2007, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Delkaetre

You should be worried about the USA's announcement that it will kidnap citizens of other countries if it feels they've committed a crime against the US.

Yes, this is quite disturbing as well... When did any of the citizens have a vote on these things? I don't seem to remember these bills of insanity on any ballots.

Oh, and I already planned on moving to Canada after college... See you there!

KontanKarite · 12-05-2007, 02:58 PM

I've thought about moving to Canada. But could it also not fall to such underhandedness? Why should I move? The way I see it, if other countries want to punish the USA, punish the government. It obviously hasn't been representing the people.

I have absolutely NO qualms at all with US soldiers and agents being tried or getting a taste of that kind of medicine if it's really going on. But if the government is doing those acts of war on other countries, then they need to remember that it wasn't the people that did it. Of course, I doubt they'd even remotely be that humane.

Drake Dun · 12-05-2007, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wormboy

I'm moving to Canada, who's with me?

I'm way ahead of you. Or maybe "farther" is the word I'm after.

Seriously, though. I didn't move here because of things going on in the U.S., but I have often reflected that my timing was serendipitous. On the rare occasions when I visit home, I am astounded by the insanity that is going on.

Drake

clockworkcoffin · 12-14-2007, 01:46 PM

canada please ^_^

7734¯7IA3 · 12-15-2007, 06:51 PM

LMFAO to those who who would want to move to Canada LOL~! You will be paying a much higher tax rate than you do in the good 'ol US of A, And as a Canadian, I am ashamed that our prime minister shit head has not taken a harder stance on global warming. You are exchanging the US for Canada but it still has the same political implications....I just read an article that Canadian soldiers are going to be in Afgan. until 2015, when it was suppossed to be 2009. How the fuck do you explain such irresposibility on the Canadian government? They fucking suck just as much as the USA sucks!!!! But, they will ALL burn in fucking hell when the almighty GOD calls then to judgement day...one by one they will be burnt alive..Ha,Ha,Ha,...Like Homer Simpson said when they opened the fire pit of hell..."mmmmm....I smell Barbeque"!!!!

Green.Lady · 12-16-2007, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 7734¯7IA3

LMFAO to those who who would want to move to Canada LOL~! You will be paying a much higher tax rate than you do in the good 'ol US of A, And as a Canadian, I am ashamed that our prime minister shit head has not taken a harder stance on global warming. You are exchanging the US for Canada but it still has the same political implications....I just read an article that Canadian soldiers are going to be in Afgan. until 2015, when it was suppossed to be 2009. How the fuck do you explain such irresposibility on the Canadian government? They fucking suck just as much as the USA sucks!!!! But, they will ALL burn in fucking hell when the almighty GOD calls then to judgement day...one by one they will be burnt alive..Ha,Ha,Ha,...Like Homer Simpson said when they opened the fire pit of hell..."mmmmm....I smell Barbeque"!!!!

I really hope you're not for real.

Dead Angel · 12-27-2007, 08:51 PM

Get physically to Canada. Then to the Eurozone (if you can find a spot in the Belalux) or Australia. (Australia being perhaps the only continent to get the fewest Nuclear missles pointed at it. IIRC.)

Johnny Gnar Gnar · 01-09-2008, 11:12 AM

I would agree. Canada is not the wonderful place it was in the sixties. Run to somewhere in backwoods Europe or to Australia or New Zealand. Be ready, the time is coming. *evil laugh*